Yamaha B1 Silent

[pdossantos]

I first want to say, great forum, it helped me a lot finding out what I needed to know about buying my piano. I do want to add the following because on my search for information I did find some negative responses on the Yamaha B1 piano which I find not true.

I bought my Yamaha B1 silent about 4 months ago and am very pleased with it. The sound is great and you get a very good value for money.
The silent system works perfectly and is very realistic, you get the samples of a Yamaha Grand piano so basically you have 2 pianos in one
I use it in the evening so I don't upset the neighbours. I love the sound of an acoustic piano but I do realise not everyone shares this opinion! (I live in the Netherlands)

The soundboard is laminated (after reading this forum I got a bit worried) but it really sounds great and is very handy in our climate so I don’t have to worry to much about a cracking soundboard in the winter when humidity get very low. (And because of that it will stay nicely tuned, twice a year tuning will do! )

The key response is fantastic and I really recommend this piano if you are looking for a decent piano but you don't have a fortune to spend on it.

I understand it is manufactured in Indonesia for lower costs, but this is done in a 100% Yamaha factory with Japanese components so you still get a very decent Yamaha piano for you money!

The finish of the piano is outstanding and I don't understand why there are so many negative reactions on smaller pianos.

I want to add this post as it seems a lot of people are looking for a good budget piano and get a lot of different answers.

Hope this will help you making a decision.

[mdw]

I think seen in isolation like a lot of cheap pianos they look fine however put it next to something half way decent and its failings show. Beacuse they have labled it as a Yamaha rather than use other names like they have in the past people will compare it to other Yamahas.
Most cheap pianos now are way better than the 2nd hand junk people were buying from the 70s and 80s. Just rememeber its a cheap pianos and always will be even 2nd hand.

[Barrie Heaton]

I understand it is manufactured in Indonesia for lower costs, but this is done in a 100% Yamaha factory with Japanese components so you still get a very decent Yamaha piano for you money!

Yamaha parts but a big Indonesia screwdriver to put them together. For the price an entry level piano with a silent system, they are very good for the price.

Barrie,

[pdossantos]

Hey Barrie,
Thanks, I hope you meant that as a positive

[Openwood]

My piano teacher bought a B1 Silent recently for doing 2-piano stuff alongside her C2, and I understand she's very happy with it. Basically it does what it says on the tin.

[markymark]

It is a very straightforward model. My friend is a piano teacher and she bought one due to space restrictions in her study. I had a go on it but it's not as good as my P121NT, either when comparing touch and tone. It's not a good representation of a typical Yamaha acoustic, but it's not bad.

Of course I didn't tell her that! I just smiled politely and said it was nice!

[pdossantos]

Great to hear some feedback from you guys.

I am happy to hear that piano teachers are also are using the B1, it is a great piano! They know a good deal when they find it!

Obviously the more you pay the more piano you get, I would love to own a grand piano but I also have to be realistic! I play piano as a hobby, not as a profession, and there was also the budget.....

When I was looking for my new piano in my price range I played some horrible chinese pianos with german names. In the lower price range there are a lot of terrible pianos. The B serie for me, really does the trick, it plays wonderfully, easy, not to heavy, the tone is very nice and melodic... it's a Yamaha and the price is fair!

What more could I ask for

[A440]

It is a good piano. Dealers get it non-prepped which brings the price down and puts the onus on the dealer to tech it properly (which it needs!) The only thing is the silent system has no midi or usb connection which means no computer interface which is, I think, generally more useful than the silent aspect especially for gcse music, arranging/composing etc.
It can't cost much to include the ports, but that's Yamaha way of making customers buy further up the range. Fiendish...!

[Openwood]

I've mentioned on another thread that I'm waiting for a fault to be rectified on our school U1 Silent, but leaving that aside for the moment, it is definitely the silent function and not the MIDI that gets the use. For various reasons it isn't actually practical for us to use the MIDI function. The silent function does (did...) get used more or less very lesson because playing can go ahead without disturbing anyone and in a school that is pretty much Nirvana. A bog standard MIDI keyboard costs so little these days that I don't think the lack of MIDI on the B1 is a problem.

[pdossantos]

Thanks for you comment OPENWOOD and A440

I agree that it doesn't cost Yamaha that much to include the midi and USB. I think you are right by assuming that they do this so people who tend to need it spend more! I think that people who need this option tend to be more professional and have a bigger budget

The Yamaha B serie is the only Yamaha series without the MIDI and USB option, I am not to bothered about recording. I need it to not disturb the neighbours as I want to play any time, night or day. (I prefer to play accousticly ofcourse but at 6 AM the neighbours would shoot me!)

If I need to record something for playback or use on the PC I use the Zoom H2 , a device that allows me to record accousticly . (Sells for 200 EURO)

[bernardmarx]

Hi

I was thinking of buying a silent piano; not decided which one just yet. I would ideally like to buy a P121, but not sure if the funds will stretch that far. I notice that the B1 and B2 are described as having 'Silent Piano', whilst other pianos (e.g. P121, Radius and U1) are described as having the 'Quick Silent System'. I know that B1/B2 do not have a midi port, but is there any other difference? Also, can anyone confirm if the new B3 has the Silent Piano or the Quick Silent System? Has anybody had a fiddle with the B3 and, if so, thoughts?

I assume that it is possible to retrofit the silent system to a second-hand U1. Assuming that it is, how much are we talking?

Finally, I came across the following:

We recommend buying an upright piano with a practice pedal rather than one with a Yamaha "Silent" system. This is because the touch on the Yamaha silent piano is compromised by the bar which comes between the hammers and the strings. As a result, the "Let off", which is the distance from the strings which the hammer reaches before the player looses control of it, increases from 2-3mm on most good ordinary pianos to 6-9mm on "silent" pianos. We find this makes soft playing more difficult both in normal and silent mode, thereby reducing the range of expression, and also gives the action a "choppy" feel.

Comments?

Many thanks

Bernard

[mdw]

If you are going to be that worried about the touch you wouldnt want to play with a practice pedal either as hitting the strings through a bit of felt affects the touch as well.
You can have a midi silent system fitted from £750 depending where you are and your piano type.
Choose your prioritys and pick your piano accordingly. If you need the silent system you could get a tech to regulate the set off in the centre 2 octaves so you can see what it will feel like most of the time when not using the system. It will cost you an hours labour to regulate it and set it back if you dont like it.

[Openwood]

We find this makes soft playing more difficult both in normal and silent mode, thereby reducing the range of expression, and also gives the action a "choppy" feel.

I haven't noticed anything 'choppy' with our U1 action in either mode, nor with any other silent piano for that matter. I'd choose a silent system any day of the week. Reasons being:

1. I found playing with a practice pedal frustrating after a few minutes because - well, basically pianos aren't supposed to sound muffled and if you aren't hearing the right sound it starts to grate pretty soon.

2. With a practice pedal your dynamic range is virtually zero. Sounds fine in theory - after all, you're 'just' practising, right? In reality the urge to play musically keeps breaking through - and so it should!

3. The felt 'muffler' things wear out, with some notes fully muffled, others partially and some not at all. Yes, they can be replaced, but in my experience spare parts for Yamahas seem to be kept somewhere up a mountain in Japan only accesible by an elderly snail for half an hour every other leap year, so don't hold your breath.

4. Although the sound is muffled with a practice pedal, it's still perfectly audible, so you get a crap sound and everyone still hates you.

Ok, the silent system uses nasty old sampled sound, but you have a far wider dynamic range, it does at least sound something like a real piano and it is, as the name implies, silent. Having said that, be aware that the noise of the regular action is still pretty clunky and if you're playing something energetic at 2am (why? for the love of God, go to sleep) the old bat next door might still be round with the rolling pin.

[Barrie Heaton]

Hi


I assume that it is possible to retrofit the silent system to a second-hand U1. Assuming that it is, how much are we talking?

They have come down in price around £850.00 for a Gabore system fitted depending on what part of the world you are in

Barrie,

[Grenache]

Hi,

I too dislike the celeste or practice pedal. You lose the dynamic range and the sound is muffled but not quiet enough to satisfy anyone who doesn't want to hear you practising.

I bought a Yamaha silent - see my comment here: http://www.uk-piano.org/piano-forums/piano5716.html

[pdossantos]

I really don't know where you guys get the information from but when I put my Yamaha B1 in silent mode it really doesn't 'chop', there is no difference it feels like your playing accousticly! The sound of the sample isnt old and nasty just get yourself a deacent pear of headphones and you have a very good sound, a sample will never sound better then the real thing but it doen't come better then this!

The yamaha silent system comes build in with an optical silent system that doesnt wear and tear like the later added versions, nor does it make a klikking sound. If you want to have a silent piano, Yamaha makes the best ones without a doubt. Go to your local dealer and play on one, I think that will awnser all your questions, id did for me and believe me , I am fussy
If you need midi OUT for any reasons, all new Yamaha's with exclusion of the B series have this. It all come down on your budget.

[mdw]

3. The felt 'muffler' things wear out, .

You dont need Yam specific stuff. Any tech will be able to order and fit you new stuff, but yes it will wear out and quite quickly if you use it a lot.

[mdw]

The yamaha silent system comes build in with an optical silent system that doesnt wear and tear like the later added versions,

You can have the add on systems with the yam style sensor rail as well and it will be midi and you wont have to buy a yam piano to get it and it will cost less..........

[Openwood]

I really don't know where you guys get the information from

From the two receivers nature has thoughtfully placed on either side of my head.

I guess everyone's reaction to the sampled sound will be different. I don't like it that much because I find it odd suddenly to be getting a concert grand sound from an upright. But, as you point out, it's as good as it gets at the moment so I'll stop whining about it.

[bernardmarx]

Hi

Thank you everyone for the responses. I should have searched the forum beforehand since several of the questions I asked had already been answered. Bloody noob.

I use the practice pedal at the moment and like most of you have already said, the range is terrible. Not only that, there is simply no fun in constantly playing a muffled instrument. It was fine when I started to learn, but it is now seriously affecting my play. I want to play without having to worry about the neighbours (walls are paper thin) or my partner. So I definately need to buy a silent system.

I was also going to use this opportunity to upgrade my piano. I am only grade 3 and the only pianos that I have played on are mine, my teachers and (on three occasions) the examiner's. So I am not entirely sure what to get (I guess that is for a different thread). But now that I know that I am serious about playing, I am quite prepared to shell out some (not too serious) money. At the moment, I am not sure whether to get a B3 Silent or a P121NTS. Difficult to find a price for the B3 + Silent.

Just one final question, if I were to buy B3 + Silent, is it possible to later install a midi option without having to resort to a complete refit? I am not interested in using the midi at the moment, but I am conscious that I may want to in future.

Thanks again.

[pdossantos]

I was in a bit of the same situation like you only I only played the teachers piano twice and that was it!
I found it very difficult to choose as you choose the piano for hopefully a long time!

You cannot install MIDI later on a B system, (not without spending lot's of money) they just dont have the ports made on the Silent unit.

I miss the record option on my silent system as it is the Simple Silent version, the Silent SG system has the MIDI, USB more voices and a recording option. I solved this by getting a nifty device called 'Zoom H2' (not to expensive, around 200 euro)
With this device you can record, from headphone jack out, or accousticly your own self played music and then hook the H2 on the computer and use those recorded files.

Hope this helps you bit,
Regards,
Happy B1 user

[A440]

Go for the Kemble 121 with silent system. Then you get the Yamaha silent system and a sweet-toned Kemble, best of both worlds.
The silent system doesn't make the piano feel different, the set-off is slightly wider whether on or off (to allow room for the bar). If you know what to feel for you can tell the difference (just) but I don't know what's meant by "choppy". It is a very, very slight difference.