Buying a new piano - some advice

[lovasco]

Dear guys, I am a novice - play some very easy jazz pieces - and own an old Nindorf that my wife used to play many years ago and that is not worth repairing (the piano, not my wife ).
I am evaluating a new Yamaha U3 with Sostenuto pedal and with or without the Silent System.
First question: as I am learning piano from scratch, does the U3 fit for a piano education process ?
Second question: does the Silent System, when disabled, impact on the actions and/or sound of the piano? In other words, does it sound and act as a traditional U3 piano without Silent System?
Thanks in advance for your advice.

[Openwood]

Hi Lovasco,

In my opinion the U3 is a very good piano indeed. I have a new U1 in the music room at school which has the silent system and I have had no problems whatsoever with the action. The silent system has been an absolute godsend and I would recommend it to anyone who needs to practice late/early/when other people are watching TV in the same room etc.

The only caveat is that technology evolves so quickly that I wonder what will happen in, say, 10 year's time when we may need spare parts and everyone is using the next generation of silent systems, but that's the same with anything you buy these days I guess.

Anyway, it sounds like the wife's still working well after all these years so you have to count your blessings

[lovasco]

Hi Openwood, thanks a lot for your advice.

My wife seems to like this piano and the silent system too.

Feedbacks on the action of a U3 seem quite positive; even maintenance (say tuning and registration) doesn't need to be done so frequently as a Steinway or a Bosendorfer, although the sound does not reach that level of quality.

I think we'll go on this way and buy a U3 SI.

Cheers.

[mdw]

You can have a silent system retro fitted to your piano. So you dont have to buy a new piano if you dont want to. There are 3 or 4 makes of system available doing roughly the same thing. Most will only go on uprights but some can be fitted to grands. Should take a good tech about half a day ( if the actions in good nick) to install. Grands perhaps a bit longer. I think they all have MIDI ins and outs so you can link to sound modules etc.

[mrbt]

Hello there,

I'm thinking about a silent yamaha too, for all the obvious reasons. I also worry about the effect on depreciation (particularly as I'm thinking of getting my first grand). I talked to Chappell about it and they said it wasn't a problem because the silent system can be completely removed and the remaining piano will be indistinguishable from a normal acoustic, should you come to sell it at a point when the electronics are out of date.

This appears to solve the problem (at least as far as grands are concerned, it seems from earlier posts that an upright wouldn't be exactly the same after the system was removed). Anyone know if this is true, or is it just saleswoman bamboozle? Any thoughts gratefully received...

[athomik]

With Yamaha Hybrid pianos (Silent, Disklavier, GranTouch), parts availability tends to be quite good for years after the model was released. It is only recently that parts are starting to run our for the MX/Wagon Grand Disklaviers and they've been out since 1987. The only slight reservation might be for parts specific to Kemble-built Silent pianos, although most electronic parts were shared with Japanese models.

[Openwood]

I have heard that retro-fitted silent systems are not always as reliable. I don't know if this is indeed the case - anyone tried it?

[athomik]

Hello there,
This appears to solve the problem (at least as far as grands are concerned, it seems from earlier posts that an upright wouldn't be exactly the same after the system was removed). Anyone know if this is true, or is it just saleswoman bamboozle? Any thoughts gratefully received...

The only difference between a non-Silent and a Silent Yamaha piano is the electronics and a slight difference in the setup - I believe the letoff is slightly more. Witht the electronics removed and the letoff adjusted to non-Silent figures, they should be identical (apart from a few screw holes inside).

[athomik]

I have heard that retro-fitted silent systems are not always as reliable. I don't know if this is indeed the case - anyone tried it?

I'm not sure what the failure rates of aftermarket in general systems are, but any system using optical sensors should be quite robust. Yamaha Silent pianos (although factory fitted) have a very low failure rate and as they use the same system, I would expect Kemble Silent (and one or two other manufacturers') pianos to be the same. Some systems use mechanical sensors/switches, which I would be wary of. Not only are mechanical contact prone to more wear, they also affect the touch of the piano.

[mdw]

Ive fitted the old technics the piano disc and and the gabor ones and had no problems with either. The piano disc ones have a flexable plastic strip that bends when you press the key. The gabor ones use a optical beam cut by a plastic blade although they are now showing one with a beam like the Yam system.

[lovasco]

I tried a new Yamaha U3 SG with Silent system and a new Schimmel C 130 T with TwinTone, which I understood is nothing else than a Yamaha-built silent system.

I loved both on every aspect: sound, action, keyboard weight and reaction, quality of the electronic equipment, although the Schimmel's TwinTone seems to be a previous version of the Silent system currently mounted on the Yamaha pianos.

Schimmel's sound is more round (better for classic) while Yamaha seems to fit best with jazz pieces. But this is left to everybody's sensibility and taste.

Schimmel's price is 15-20% higher then Yamaha's. At least, at the dealers I visited.

I understood Yamahas require less maintenance (tuning, etc) compared to Schimmels, especially when used intensely (say 3-4 hours/day).

Now, the choice is very difficult. Based on price and maintenance, a U3 seems to be a better choice.

I would be very glad if you could share with me your opinions on that. Thanks.

[mdw]

I dont think you should worry to much about maintenance/ tuning. Keep the temp and humdity stable and both should be ok. You are going to have to have it tuned and at some time pay for a bit of maintenance, like buying and running a car. If you really like the Schimmel better to buy that and pay for a bit of regulating a few years down the line than buy something you are not 100% happy with to save on a few hours labour later on.
Even if the Schimmel is the old Yam silent system with one sound you can still add sound modules fairly cheaply and then pick the sounds you want rather than the ones Yam want you to have. I think in the past Gabor could supply the key pickup strip midi compatable and you added the rest. I only ever fitted the whole system so not sure on the details.

[A440]

The old system has no midi interface however which is pretty useful. How do you fit a sound interface with no midi?

[lovasco]

Thank you mdw. I'm also waiting to try a new Yamaha YUS5 SI that should be at the dealer's premises in a few days. Featurs are very interesting: hammers, chords and keys same as the top SU series. A little more expensive that the U3 SG (+1,800 euros app.). I'll let you know.