Trade in my upright for a baby grand

[chrisw]

Once again I am having thoughts of changing my upright for a grand but this time being fairly certain that there would be enough room in the dining room bay window to accommodate it. The window faces east but I would still take steps to protect the piano from sunlight.

The reason for changing is to acquire a grand action which should be slightly easier to control and have faster repetition. The richness of the bass would be of lesser importance. It will be the width of the piano rather than length that is the limiting dimension but in terms of length anything up to 180cm should be ok.

There seem to be a number of Kawai GX-2 pianos in local show rooms which I could go and try and would be prepared to invest this amount of money but not more. If I travel further I could audition the Kawai GL-10, GX-1 and GX-2 side by side and choose the one which would suit me best. Next thoughts are should I put the Feurich 163 into the mix, or indeed include used pianos such as the Kawai KG-2 ?

Before setting off on my search I intend making a paper template to help my judgement of the space that is available. I have also measured the speaking length of the lowest bass string in my Kemble Classic and find that it is 98cm and I will compare this with what they are in baby grands.

Is there anything else I should bear in mind if and when I go shopping. If I come across a good used piano I will of course need it inspecting.

[Barrie Heaton]

On your paper template don't forget the piano stool.

If you're happy to travel then consider piano auctions in London sadly due to the lurgy there are quite a few people who are selling there Pianos as they need the money.

One of my customers got a very nice grand good price from Park Pianos in Bolton.

Barrie

[G3och]

Hi Chris

Id also recommend Park Pianos. If your looking at Feurichs you can also try the Hailuns at Park Pianos (made in same factory as Feurich but i think these are some how better quality). I think the Hailun Grands have been very well reviewed online, ive personally never played a Hailun though.

In terms of Feurich 163, i previously owned a Feurich Upright so id recommend checking everything even if its new (cabinet construction and string quality/stringing). I might of been unlucky but the one i owned had very bad craftsmanship which was denied by Feurich themselves despite the evidence.

The only Feurich dealers in the area are Besbrodes in Leeds, Sherwood Phoenix in Mansfield and Full Octave in Cumbria.

I think you could get a really nice used Yamaha C1/C2 or Kawai RX2 depending on your budget.

It might be a bit difficult with the lockdown though.

[chrisw]

Hello George,
I think I now recall your name from a post last year when you were asking for advice about changing your Feurich upright. Also sorry for taking a few days to reply, I have only just seen your post.

Thanks for the info and advice. I have managed to discuss Feurich pianos with the owner of The Full Octave and my own piano tuner who has worked on a couple. For business reasons The Full Octave are to cease selling brand new pianos however they think that Feurich are very well engineered. My tuner thinks they are reasonable but has had to do some warranty work on a Feurich grand.

When this lock down ends I intend visiting Park Pianos to look at Hailuns, go to Besbrodes in Leeds and perhaps Sherwood Phoenix. A piano dealer in Ringwood, Chris Vendables pianos, also sells his own brand of Hailun made pianos and although it is quite a long way may pay them a visit. Our local Kawai dealers are in Preston.

A couple of things I like about Hailun made pianos is the use of rust free strings and the larger castors on the legs.

[Barrie Heaton]

They will be plated strings instead of polished strings and they come with their own problems, especially if the plating starts to come off it can make them false as hell.

If you're in a very salty area and you have problems with rusty strings consider a string blanket they use them a lot on the east coast of America.

Barrie

[chrisw]

Thanks for the advice Barrie. Perhaps I will put Kawai at the top of the list. Should I be worried if the piano I select doesn't have duplex scaling ? Manufacturers seem to make much of duplex but I can't see that it makes that much difference.

[Barrie Heaton]

duplex scaling can be a blessing or pain Yamaha tends to get the scaling correct, sometimes Kawai gets it wrong on smaller grands Boston pianos can be very bad and very good.

Some of the cheap and cheerful Chinese Pianos I wish they didn't bother it makes it difficult to get pure top trouble.

A good duplex scaling can make the piano sing same with capo scaling.

Barrie

[G3och]

Hi Chris

Im probably biased against Feurich from past experiences but i would probably not look at any of tech specs as its all marketting at the end of the day. Ive fallen for this trap before! I think the more you look at the specs the more you convince yourself to a single brand (Feurich, duplex scaling, roslau strings, wurzen hammers, Kawai ABS action immune to humidity changes and their tapered soundboards etc)

Do rust free strings really make a difference? I mean i played second hand pianos from 1970s when i was looking for my upright and never saw rusty strings (maybe they got changed but its very unlikely). If your living in the North West im pretty sure the rust free strings are just a nice to have.

I found on a lot of Chinese made pianos now or new brands they are cheaper than established brands but throw loads of nice to haves to get people to buy.

I didn't really notice any difference between the Roslau on my last piano and the yamaha strings currently (are they suzuki strings?). Im assuming it comes down to voicing, one was super bright and my yamaha is in the middle but has better dynamics and just nicer to play overall.

In terms of duplex scaling (probably because it was on an upright) i didnt really notice much which was even agreed by other dealers selling the same piano.

Everything is built to a price so id recommend really playing every brand you can afford, my Feurich had structural issues and these were passed off as normal by Feurich Technicians so warranties these days don't really mean anything. I was probably lucky the dealership finally agreed with me and gave me a full refund after they saw my videos.

I think just play loads, go for touch and tone. I mean i tried a Yamaha SE122, really enjoyed it but had sat on the shopfloor for 7 years then was pushed towards a Schimmel Classic that was more expensive and told its better than Yamaha with the renner action etc. I hated playing that piano.

Every pianos each to their own i guess. The only thing i can really vouch for is the Feurich Bass on my 125 was absolutely amazing, i think the scale the strings at a wider angle so they are longer.

You could look at Yorkshire Pianos too and try a Cavendish, i never managed to visit there.

Ive heard very good things about Chris Venables and Coach House Pianos.

[chrisw]

Hello Barrie and George, thank you for your recent posts. If I do start piano shopping I will try as many brands as I can and I am now going to include the Yamaha C1x in the list. At the moment I am quite enjoying the sound that my Kemble makes although periodically I start to wonder if the quicker and more responsive action of a grand would help my playing. Stocks of new pianos in dealership seem to be at an all time low at present so guess I will have to wait until at least the middle of the year, unless I see a good used one.

[Barrie Heaton]

Bluthner are having a lockdown sale. Blüthner Style IX grand £9K

Barie

[chrisw]

Thanks Barrie. Just had a look at the Bluthner site and now realise I ought to find out more about their Irmler brand.

[Barrie Heaton]

I have a few Irmler on my rounds. the smaller uprights are okay Kawai are better the big ones some of them are nice for the price.

The secondary makes by the big piano manufacturers have similar characteristics it's all down to how well they've been prepped. Some you sit in front of you think wow that's is nice, then with some, you think how can you justify that price for that pretty box with strings in.

So how did the piano zoom meeting go

Barrie

[chrisw]

Thanks Barrie. It went well yesterday. We had one new member join the online group and a full programme of music. We record the music onto YouTube and play it using Zoom shared screen and sound as this gives the best sound quality. I seem to have a corruption on my computer, which is used as the Zoom host, in that there have been times when the encryption of sound being transmitted from me has been lost. I then have to shutdown Zoom and start it up again to restore sound.