Used Kemble Upright Classic?

[ignited-red]

Hi there, I'm from Jakarta - Indonesia.
Recently I bought used piano, Kemble, from local piano store.

What makes me fall for this piano is that the sound were very grandeur for an upright type, it has a responsive key for an old piano and in a very good condition (checking the hammer, soundboard, etc)

I asked the store owner about the history of this Kemble, he said the first owner bought this piano from UK in 1998 then shipped it to Jakarta, as the owner stays and working here for a very long time. After a while, he decided to go back to UK but didn't bring the piano because of the expensive cost mover from Jakarta to UK.

Makes me wonder what type is my Kemble, when did it produced, is it really in 98 or older. As I looked inside checking for serial number, couldn't find it anywhere. Just a series of digit number on a metal plate underneath the piano's top lid, near the strings and soundboard:

IMG_3848.JPG

I did try to trace those digit numbers through internet but nothing could be found.

This is my Kemble looks like:

IMG_3848.JPG

I supposed this is Kemble Oxford, it did similar with my searching through internet and found this link: http://www.yorkshirepianos.com/kemble-oxford/

Any insight and suggestions would be helpful, thank you :)

[Bill Kibby]

The procedure for attaching images here is quite difficult, it is no good giving the name of the image.
The piano might seem old to you, but I am surrounded by much older pianos, which are often amazing for their age. My Archives page
http://www.pianohistory.info/archives.html
explains the problems with this type of enquiry in general, and mentions that although the Kemble information has been preserved at Hackney Archives, it is not available for reference yet. My Datemarks page
http://www.pianohistory.info/datemarks.html
explains that your best hope is that if you remove the keys of the bottom notes, there may be markings there.

[chrisw]

If your piano is black polyester it could be the Oxford, the Traditional or the K121C. If it has a wood veneer it could be the Empire. It depends on the height of the piano as follows;
Oxford 110cm
Traditional 116cm
K121C 121cm
Empire 116cm.

It sounds as though you have found the serial number. Kemble serial numbers are easy to find on the internet but if you are having difficulty tell us what it is and we will reply with the year.

I agree with Bill, it can't be an old piano, it just isn't absolutely new.

[ignited-red]

Hello, thank you for your insight. It's very helpful. Yes I found it very hard to uploading some of pictures in this forum, yep this is my piano and the serial number, i suppose (finally I can attached the picture).

If you can't read it through, this is the serial number: 712010422.

Beside the number, there's written Yamaha Corporation. I supposed Kemble already did merged their company to Yamaha around 1998.

I also did searched that serial number through your website and kemble official website, but did found nothing as result.

[ignited-red]

If your piano is black polyester it could be the Oxford, the Traditional or the K121C. If it has a wood veneer it could be the Empire. It depends on the height of the piano as follows;
Oxford 110cm
Traditional 116cm
K121C 121cm
Empire 116cm.

It sounds as though you have found the serial number. Kemble serial numbers are easy to find on the internet but if you are having difficulty tell us what it is and we will reply with the year.

I agree with Bill, it can't be an old piano, it just isn't absolutely new.

My piano is black polyester with height 121 cm. The store owner said it is equal to K121C, but when I saw K121C there's quite a bit different (although slightly looks same) such as the pedals and Kemble logo.

Mine looks very similar to Oxford : http://www.yorkshirepianos.com/kemble-oxford/

Also mine got a gold plat that says: "specially manufactured for tropical climates, anti termite protected" --> also did not found this plat on other Kemble.

[chrisw]

The Kemble Oxford is shorter than your piano and if yours is 121 cm high it is a K121C. The shape of the Kemble logo did change over the years and perhaps the shape of the pedals also. The logo on my piano is a brass oval plate. I couldn't find the height of the piano displayed by Yorkshire pianos and without the height I would not like to say which model it is.

The number you give as the serial number has too many digits. I wonder if the first 71 signifies it was made for a different climate. If the serial number is 201042 it was made in 1980 but this is just speculation on my part. Please see the attached file.

http://kemble-pianos.com/en/information/serials/

However I do think your piano was made before 1994, which is the year of my piano, because of the shape of the logo underneath the fall.

[chrisw]

Correction after looking at your photographs in more detail.

I would doubt that the number photographed is the serial number of the piano. On my piano the serial number can be seen on the very top of the iron frame on the right hand side and it is painted on. I can see my number just by lifting the top lid but on yours it might be obscured by the top ledge of the frame.

[ignited-red]

The Kemble Oxford is shorter than your piano and if yours is 121 cm high it is a K121C. The shape of the Kemble logo did change over the years and perhaps the shape of the pedals also. The logo on my piano is a brass oval plate. I couldn't find the height of the piano displayed by Yorkshire pianos and without the height I would not like to say which model it is.

The number you give as the serial number has too many digits. I wonder if the first 71 signifies it was made for a different climate. If the serial number is 201042 it was made in 1980 but this is just speculation on my part. Please see the attached file.

http://kemble-pianos.com/en/information/serials/

However I do think your piano was made before 1994, which is the year of my piano, because of the shape of the logo underneath the fall.

Hi Chrisw, does Kemble do produce piano outside UK region? I never see this piano in Indonesia, it wasn’t popular like Kawai or Yamaha in here

Yes after reading info from this forum, it might be K121C older type, mine is 121cm height

[chrisw]

Kemble produced pianos in the UK until 2009 when the Yamaha Corporation moved production to Indonesia. They did send pianos to other countries but relative to Yamaha or Kawai, only in small numbers. Please see the attached video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gx2YrjHiWc

[ignited-red]

Kemble produced pianos in the UK until 2009 when the Yamaha Corporation moved production to Indonesia. They did send pianos to other countries but relative to Yamaha or Kawai, only in small numbers. Please see the attached video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Gx2YrjHiWc

Thanks a lot for the info, been looking through. Mine got stamped Yamaha Corporation on the iron plate, I supposed some of the part such as strings when wore out, can be replace using Yamaha's such as Yamaha U3? Since U3 is the closest model to Kemble 121cm height.

[chrisw]

I believe that Kemble acquired their own strings, not Yamaha strings. This was partly to give the piano an English sound. When the copper wound strings are replaced they are usually made specially for each individual piano and hopefully you will never have to replace them. Is there a label on the action, "Langer" for example.

[ignited-red]

I believe that Kemble acquired their own strings, not Yamaha strings. This was partly to give the piano an English sound. When the copper wound strings are replaced they are usually made specially for each individual piano and hopefully you will never have to replace them. Is there a label on the action, "Langer" for example.

Yes there is, "Langer 100". What is your Kemble type?
What is the difference between Langer 100, 80, 75? Pardon my question, I'm newbie for acoustic piano

[chrisw]

I don't know the difference. Most likely to be size of one of the components. What is important is that your piano has the English action, which I believe are good quality. Langer actions are the successors to Herrburger Brooks actions and you can find an article on their history on this forum. My piano has a Langer action.
I would guess that the only Yamaha component inside your piano is the iron frame. Perhaps one of the piano technicians on this forum could comment.

[chrisw]

Post deleted after I couldn't be sure of the information that it was based on. I was trying to link to a picture of a K121 with its front panel removed to show the position of the serial number. I realised that the piano shop had got its photographs mixed up and the piano it said was a Kemble was not a Kemble.

[ignited-red]

I don't know the difference. Most likely to be size of one of the components. What is important is that your piano has the English action, which I believe are good quality. Langer actions are the successors to Herrburger Brooks actions and you can find an article on their history on this forum. My piano has a Langer action.
I would guess that the only Yamaha component inside your piano is the iron frame. Perhaps one of the piano technicians on this forum could comment.

Hi chrisw, sorry late reply. I was wondering why my piano doesn't show visible serial numbers just like other piano. People say to look underneath the key, haven't do that. I have to ask my piano technician to open it

Yes I believe that hammer action is a good one, as I played it, it has a very responsive key. Yes true, the only component of Yamaha is the iron frame, I guess they merged companies during that year of production.

Unbelievably that piano is in a very immaculate condition, I was surprised when the shop owner told me it was from 98. It took 21 years but still run greatly. I think the previous owner really take a good care of the piano and I got lucky to have bought that piano home.

I bought it in price IDR21.000 (around 1.200GBP) well I think it is cheap for used piano with great condition. In Indonesia, people did not fancy European piano that much, so that's why most of piano shop here only sell Yamaha or Kawai. Those two brand are very popular, almost every home has it. The owner said, no one asked for Kemble in his shop, only me as customer. So that's why he sold to me with a decent price.

[ignited-red]

Post deleted after I couldn't be sure of the information that it was based on. I was trying to link to a picture of a K121 with its front panel removed to show the position of the serial number. I realised that the piano shop had got its photographs mixed up and the piano it said was a Kemble was not a Kemble.

That's okay, can you upload yours? I want to see the similarity I think we do have the same type piano

[chrisw]

You can find photographs showing the position of Kemble's serial number, and also images of my piano in this post;
https://www.piano-tuners.org/piano-foru ... f=3&t=9763

These pianos are a different model to the one you have but I would expect the serial number to be in the same position, in the top right hand corner of the iron frame. My piano is the black polyester model and if you enlarge the second of the three images you can make out the serial number. The other piano mentioned in the thread has an explicit photograph of the serial number.

[Barrie Heaton]

Herrburger Brooks made the Langer 75 for small piano with 85 and 88 notes. The Langer 80 was developed in 1980 for pianos above 130 to 150mm shank length. The Langer 100 was the same action as the Langer 80, Kembles called it the 100 as a marketing ploy. The management at Herrburger agreed to the renaming just for Kemble piano stable.


your piano looks like a
The CT121 Contemporary Collection

Superb sound
Based on our award winning K121 model, voted ‘Best Buy’ by European consumer association Conseur, the new CT121 has the same rich and resonant sonority. With its enhanced dynamic range and wonderful tonal colours, the CT121 is the perfect instrument for the professional player or discerning amateur.

Stunning design
For customers who require a high quality modern instrument with genuine style, the CT121 combines distinctive curves and flowing lines in an eye-catching design. Available with brass or chrome fittings the CT121 will complement any interior, contemporary or traditional.Silent option

The new CT121 will also be available with the latest SG silent system. This state-of-the-art concept allows the pianist to bypass the natural acoustics and transmit the sound digitally through headphones or speakers. It features a superb piano sound as well as nine other voices, each with variation, USB, and allows both recording and playback.

Available in:Black polyester with brass Black polyester with chrome

Model dimensions:

Height 122 cm
Depth 62 cm
Width 153 cm

or

The K121CL - Professional Collection

Our professional range of pianos, owing to longer keys, larger soundboard, and longer bass strings offer greater sensitivity of touch, and an enhanced dynamic range to produce a very impressive richness of sound for the discerning pianist. The exceptional clarity of pitch and superb sustain make them a delight to play.

K121CL-detail-2.jpg - 5430 BytesThe new K121CL is the latest version of our award winning K121 series. The K121 was judged as "Maitre-Achat" or "Best Buy" by Conseur, an independent European Consumer Association, for its performance, quality and value for money. The K121 came second only to a Steinway model of nearly 4 times its price. The "playing" panel was composed of 37 well known concert pianists from around the world. The good news is that the superb sound and performance of the K121 is now available at a more affordable price owing to our new classic but contemporary cabinet design. Enjoy the power of our bass, the crystal clarity of our treble, and the simple beauty of our cabinet. Practice pedal comes as standard; solid double brass castors.

Available in American Walnut Satin, Mahogany Polyester, Walnut Satin Polyester and Black Polyester



Barrie

[Barrie Heaton]

you also have K121ZT


SOUNDBOARD AREA: 13969cm2

SPEAKING LENGTH OF NO 1 BASS STRING: 119cm



The combination of a new scale, a larger soundboard area, and longer bass strings has resulted in a significantly improved sound quality, particularly noticeable in the bass.

KEYBED HEIGHT: 65cm

The higher keybed not only makes the piano better proportioned, but also produces a more comfortable playing position.

CABINET

The K121ZT is our new softline version of the successful K121Z. Along with new softly profiled lines it incorporates luxury features including an inlaid leather music desk and an inlaid brass name. The grid has also been strengthened which further improves its dynamic performance.

Specifications and finishes available

88 Note
Height 121 cm
Depth 61.5 cm
Width 153 cm
Mahogany Polyester
Walnut Colour (Mahogany) Polyester
Georgian Mahogany Lustre
Black Polyester

[ignited-red]

You can find photographs showing the position of Kemble's serial number, and also images of my piano in this post;
https://www.piano-tuners.org/piano-foru ... f=3&t=9763

These pianos are a different model to the one you have but I would expect the serial number to be in the same position, in the top right hand corner of the iron frame. My piano is the black polyester model and if you enlarge the second of the three images you can make out the serial number. The other piano mentioned in the thread has an explicit photograph of the serial number.

Great, thanks chrisw

[ignited-red]

Herrburger Brooks made the Langer 75 for small piano with 85 and 88 notes. The Langer 80 was developed in 1980 for pianos above 130 to 150mm shank length. The Langer 100 was the same action as the Langer 80, Kembles called it the 100 as a marketing ploy. The management at Herrburger agreed to the renaming just for Kemble piano stable.


your piano looks like a
The CT121 Contemporary Collection

Superb sound
Based on our award winning K121 model, voted ‘Best Buy’ by European consumer association Conseur, the new CT121 has the same rich and resonant sonority. With its enhanced dynamic range and wonderful tonal colours, the CT121 is the perfect instrument for the professional player or discerning amateur.

Stunning design
For customers who require a high quality modern instrument with genuine style, the CT121 combines distinctive curves and flowing lines in an eye-catching design. Available with brass or chrome fittings the CT121 will complement any interior, contemporary or traditional.Silent option

The new CT121 will also be available with the latest SG silent system. This state-of-the-art concept allows the pianist to bypass the natural acoustics and transmit the sound digitally through headphones or speakers. It features a superb piano sound as well as nine other voices, each with variation, USB, and allows both recording and playback.

Available in:Black polyester with brass Black polyester with chrome

Model dimensions:

Height 122 cm
Depth 62 cm
Width 153 cm

or

The K121CL - Professional Collection

Our professional range of pianos, owing to longer keys, larger soundboard, and longer bass strings offer greater sensitivity of touch, and an enhanced dynamic range to produce a very impressive richness of sound for the discerning pianist. The exceptional clarity of pitch and superb sustain make them a delight to play.

K121CL-detail-2.jpg - 5430 BytesThe new K121CL is the latest version of our award winning K121 series. The K121 was judged as "Maitre-Achat" or "Best Buy" by Conseur, an independent European Consumer Association, for its performance, quality and value for money. The K121 came second only to a Steinway model of nearly 4 times its price. The "playing" panel was composed of 37 well known concert pianists from around the world. The good news is that the superb sound and performance of the K121 is now available at a more affordable price owing to our new classic but contemporary cabinet design. Enjoy the power of our bass, the crystal clarity of our treble, and the simple beauty of our cabinet. Practice pedal comes as standard; solid double brass castors.

Available in American Walnut Satin, Mahogany Polyester, Walnut Satin Polyester and Black Polyester



Barrie

Hi Barrie, I think my Kemble would be either CT121 or KC121CL. I do believe that mine were produced between 1980-1990, consider the logo of Kemble were different than the new ones. Does CT121 produce that type during that year?

Yes my action is Langer 100

Also underneath the iron frame, there's a plat says Yamaha Corporation.

[ignited-red]

you also have K121ZT


SOUNDBOARD AREA: 13969cm2

SPEAKING LENGTH OF NO 1 BASS STRING: 119cm



The combination of a new scale, a larger soundboard area, and longer bass strings has resulted in a significantly improved sound quality, particularly noticeable in the bass.

KEYBED HEIGHT: 65cm

The higher keybed not only makes the piano better proportioned, but also produces a more comfortable playing position.

CABINET

The K121ZT is our new softline version of the successful K121Z. Along with new softly profiled lines it incorporates luxury features including an inlaid leather music desk and an inlaid brass name. The grid has also been strengthened which further improves its dynamic performance.

Specifications and finishes available

88 Note
Height 121 cm
Depth 61.5 cm
Width 153 cm
Mahogany Polyester
Walnut Colour (Mahogany) Polyester
Georgian Mahogany Lustre
Black Polyester

for K121ZT, I'm not sure. The height is the same 121 cm, the top lid for K121ZT are open half, mine can fully open. Perhaps Kemble does a lot of changes and improvement during their production year. I search through the internet, found a lot of Kemble's logo with different style as well.