Age of a Collard & Collard square?

[JJO5O]

Can anyone tell me the year this piano was made? Its number is #1641. Thank you!

[Bill Kibby]

The design does not offer any obvious clues. For information about Collard numbers see
http://pianogen.org/numbers.html

Sadly, no dates are available for these 4-digit numbers. There may be other clues at
http://pianogen.org/square.html

[JJO5O]

Thank you so much for the information, Bill.

I have done a bit of research on this piano. I am hoping to confirm some conclusions.

Do you think it is safe to say that this piano was definitely made after 1832, as it is a "Collard & Collard Late Clementi, Collard, & Collard"?

[Bill Kibby]

To be pedantic, I would say it is definitely after 1831, the earliest it could be is 1832. By 1845, they had larger numbers, so it is probably 1830s, but nobody has any precise dates for all these 4-digit numbers. The best estimate I can offer for it is "circa 1835".

[Gill the Piano]

It looks like a late one, because it's so hefty. You could try Lucy Coad (google her) who repairs squares and has an encyclopaedic knowledge of them!

[Bill Kibby]

You may be right. Unfortunately, the only solid clue is the number, and it's not so very different from Collards or Broadwoods of the 1840s and 1850s. I can't help wondering if there is a larger number in there.

[JJO5O]

Gill, thank you so much for pointing me to Lucy Coad. Her website is really impressive. I'll contact her.

Bill, thank you for all of your assistance. "Circa 1835" was my guess. I mainly based that on info from Makers of the Piano Volume 2 1820-1860 by Martha Novak Clinkscale. #1641 is the only number I've been able to find in the piano. I've searched pretty carefully. Where would the serial number normally be located?

[Bill Kibby]

They tend to be near the back edge inside the top, as shown in my diagram on the numbers page I mentioned before. The larger numbers also tend to be handwritten.

Is there any chance we could see inside the top with the fret panels removed?