Piano Rebuilding

[joseph]

This isn't a thread about the viability of piano rebuilding - I know about that, but bear with my long-winded question:

At one time, when rebuilding old pianos, that using outsized pins in the pinblock, and repairing original soundboards was a better option than replacing the board and pinblock, and reconditioning the old action and keyboard was likewise more viable than replacing the action and keyboard.

When did it become virtually standard practice to replace pinblocks, soundboards, actions and keyboards? Was it the case that 30 or 40 years ago, the pianos from the late 19th and early 20th Century were still young enough to retain original parts, or is it that the cost of parts has made it a more attractive option?

Steinway and Sons, when preparing pianos for sale in their own showroom, virtually always replace the action and pinblock on pianos over 25 years old (although there are exceptions), and I haven't seen a pre-1940 Steinway for sale in their showroom that hasn't had a new soundboard fitted. I know that these pianos command huge prices, so I do take that into consideration in the question.

Paul and Colin Leverett always replace soundboards on the pre-war pianos because they say that they achieve far superior results than shimming the original board. They have retained soundboards on some of the younger pianos that they have rebuilt where a replacement wouldn't necessarily be an improvement. They do rebuild original actions (including the Bluthner Patent and other types of antiquated action) with exceptional results but they also replace actions and keyboards when requested or required - for instance if they are preparing a piano for sale in the London showroom, and the action is an outdated type.

I know I could ask Paul and Colin, or David Widdicombe at Steinways these questions, but I also want to ask the technicians here, who perhaps don't have access to the London sales market for instance, who are out on the field restoring and improving pianos for those who can't afford/aren't willing to spend the money on a full rebuild. I know that if you're talking about spending £6000 or something for an action overhaul, restring and clean out, it's quite a jump to think about spending £15,000 - to £30,000 on a full rebuild.

I have played many pianos that have been rebuilt by both Steinways and Piano Restorations, and I have absolutely loved them all. I have also played many beautiful unrestored pianos and partially restored pianos - as well as unrestored and partially restored pianos that have been pretty shoddy! One fine example is a Bluthner style 7 in a school that I used to teach at in Scotland. It had the original soundboard, original action, original hammers, original strings, basically untouched. The piano had splits all over the board, it had stuff poured inside it, the felts were completely worn, the hammers were cut, the dampers weren't returning properly and the strings were snapping and dulling. However, this piano still had the magic about it, it was still serviceable (even though it was 1895), and very much still playable - even if it was really requiring the full works. ANother one is an 1870s Style II Steinway I had to give a concert on. The piano's soundboard was BLACK with the amount of liquid poured in it, the action was clogged up and even its legs were close to falling off. When I first got my hands on it, the piano had no tone. I took the initiative to clean the soundboard with soap and water solution (look, I know it's bad, but the piano was pretty far beyond it's musical life and hadn't been tuned in 30 years, let alone played!), and dried it immediately. Not only did the board come up looking really clean, but the piano actually started to sing! I gave the recital and the audience were none the wiser on the condition of the piano. It actually had a beautiful sound, fundamentally, albeit tired out.

Anyway the reason I'm asking about replacing vs reparing originals, is in response to Barrie's quip 'the good old days when parts were more expensive than labour' or something....

[Barrie Heaton]

Cost and reliability if you restore a piano and it goes in dry environment very common theses days you can end up with lose tuning pin and have to repin or replace the plank so better to replace for the start regardless as most give a 5 year Garra I use to

and also... the knock on effect Mr Smith down the road includes replacing the wrest plank for that price As to soundboards they just got affordable in the last 10 years can be cheaper to fit a new one than repair the board and bridge

The question is if all is left is the case and frame is the piano still a ....Grand if it is not done by the maker

Barrie

[vernon]

We have for sale a beautiful 1909 Bechstein grand in largely solid mahogany Sheraton case with carved legs and cheeks.
Everything appears original--hammers,strings, belly etc'.
The ivories are Daz white and it is in beautiful un-worn condition.
Should I wrench out it's heart when it is fit to do another 100 years as it is ?
There is too much vandalism to old pianos as it is.

[joseph]

That's quite a statement Vernon!

I agree that if you have a piano that is old but is still that good, you might want to leave it as is, and give the next buyer the chance to purchase it original and do what they want with it. Probably most people would play that and think there was no point in restoration.

But I'm talking about pianos which are really very tired and need attention of sorts.

[pianotechman]

I favour fitting a new laminated plank when re-stringing even if it seems ok. If that instrument goes into a modern warm environment, and the plank splits, your going to have to do the whole job again, assuming the client has any confidence left in you!
Some old Bechstein upright models nearly always have a problem in the Tenor section, quite simply because the pins are not staggered at that point and 1/4" of straight grained timber between them is just not enough to take the load.

[pianotechman]

Onto soundboards, if the board still has plenty of crown/spring in it after you have de-strung the piano, why not repair any splits with similarly well seasoned spruce strips? There is a school of thought that think sound travels along the grain better as the timber ages. You tell somone who has a Victorian cello or 'Strad' violin that you intend to rip off the top and replace it with a new one, and I think you would get very short shrift! I think the cost of a new board probably out weighs the cost of repairing,scraping and re-finishing the old one in many cases. Even with a new board, that will also split if it's kept in the wrong environment, and it's probably modern kiln seasoned spruce to boot! The original board would have been made from air dried stock piled timber.