New Kawai Piano

[Kentos1978]

Hello all. After posting last month about looking for a 2nd hand piano for about £500, I started looking in piano showrooms and did an about turn and decided to buy new - oh and increase the budget massively!

After trying a considerable number of pianos, I plumped for a Kawai K3 which arrived earlier this week. The piano having only been in the house a few days is still awaiting its first tuning (probably not for at least a few weeks) but I am a bit worried about the sound on some of the keys and do not know whether this is something I should raise with the retailer or attribute to the moving of the piano and it still needing to be tuned.

There a couple of sounding problems. My biggest worry is the fact that about 5 notes on the second highest octave play as if the sustain pedal is permanently depressed - these notes sound for far longer than those toward the middle of the piano. I have also identified a rasping/buzzing sound on playing a couple of the keys in the middle of the keyboard. Neither of these issues were apparent on playing the piano in the showroom. I guess I am just wondering whether I am expecting too much of a piano that has been moved in freezing conditions and come into a centrally heated house and not been tuned. Are these just tuning issues that I need to ignore for now or should I be more bothered and get on the phone to the retailer?

Completely separately, one of the keys has a microscopic chip out of it. It is so small I only detected it at first by touch. I don't think I really want a replacement key but combined with the sustain and buzzing keys, it is dampening my enjoyment of an otherwise lovely piano.

Any advice would be much appreciated - thanks!


I took delivery of my new Kawai K3 on Tuesday

[Colin Nicholson]

It's not uncommon for a brand new piano to go out of tune quickly - this is normal.
With sudden changes in temperature, the soundboard & bridges will be microscopically changing shape and the strings will change pitch.

A new piano takes around 2 years to settle.... you will need to have the piano tuned around 3-4 times for year 1, then twice in year 2.... but this depends on your central heating. Your piano must not be directly near a radiator.

Each treble note has 3 strings - known as a tri-chord. If you open the top lid, play a note, you will see a hammer hitting 3 strings at the same time. It is likely that one or 2 of these strings has dropped in pitch. When a piano is tuned, all 3 strings should sound as one (unison). Your piano will take several weeks to settle down.

What is the approximate temperature of your room with heating on?

Ask your retailer about purchasing a hygrometer - you should have one on your piano, to measure humidity and temperature.

The highest notes dont have dampers - all pianos have between 65 - 70 dampers, which in turn mute each note when you release a key. After or between the 65-70th damper (around 2 octaves above middle C), the strings ring on slightly - this is normal. However, if the note is below this region, the damper or sustain pedal may need adjusting.

I would contact your retailer asap about the chipped key - they should replace the key top (not the whole key).

However, wait for around 2 weeks to book your tuning - then the buzzing noises should stop.

Hope that helps

[Barrie Heaton]

Hi Kentos1978

Colin has answered your concerns which can be sorted when the tuner comes . However, on the chipped key as it is only a micro chip if it is on the top of the key and not the edge, the tuner may opt to buff out the chip. Don't be alarmed you be surprised how many new pianos get micro chipped keys in the showroom most can be buffed out its caused by clumsy Tuners, cleaners and the worse one is folk playing the piano with rings. Do tell the shop about the chip key so that the tuner can come prepared .


Enjoy your Kawai Piano they are very nice well made pianos


Barrie

[Kentos1978]

Thank you both. I feel I am getting an education every time I post here!

I feel reassured but still just a little uneasy about the sustained ringing on the top notes. I had not appreciated that they were undamped and I guess this must mean they have to ring on but it just seems to go on for so long, it sounds odd. Even my old clunky piano did not ring on as long. I will discuss with the tuner when he comes anyway and see if he thinks there is a problem (although it sounds like not).

At the moment we don't have the heating on in the room the piano is in and it is a seldom used room but for the piano. It is not especially cold though because the house is newish and well insulated, I would be surprised if it was below 17/18 degrees. That may changed come summer time though as the sun shines straight into the room and it does get warmer. I was thinking about getting a temperature gauge and hygrometer but had heard that they could give quite inaccurate readings. I asked the dealer about controlling temperature and humidity and he said that generally there should not be a problem and no particular steps need be taken. I think I would like to get a hygrometer and temperature gauge now though - are there any you would recommend?

I will also call the dealer and flag up the chipped key. The chip is right on the end lip of the key so kind of overlaps top and slightly underneath. It would be nice to have it sorted though and even better if it does not require a whole new key.

I should say, I am really delighted with the piano apart from these little issues!

Thanks again

[Barrie Heaton]

if the chip is on the edge then it may have to be a replacement top

As to the hygrometer we sell them on this site the digital ones are better

Barrie

[Colin Nicholson]

If you want us to confirm its the damper or not, you will need to be more specific - "top notes" is too vague, sorry. Do you know what the dampers look like?

They are located infront and just under the hammers - the small pieces of square white felt.... at rest, they should be touching the strings.

If you open the top lid right back, then the note that rings on, press that key very slowly, about half way - look inside, and you will see the hammer moving forward towards the string. "Freeze" everything there before the hammer reaches the string - take a photo of the hammer just moving forward, and send it to us. Otherwise at this stage, its guess work. Your Kawai will have much better down'bearing and sustain on new strings - no comparison to old pianos.

Alternatively, just contact your tuner.

[NewAge]

Congratulations on your K3. An excellent choice.

You say you asked the dealer about controlling temperature and humidity, and he said that generally there should not be a problem and no particular steps need be taken.
Many dealers are very professional, but some are not. Any dealer that states that no particular steps need be taken to control temp & humidity would put am immediate flea in my ear.
The next time you see him/her, you may like to ask why it is that many of the well-known serious piano manufacturers advise that temp/humidity should be controlled to be as stable as possible. Ideally this should be approx 21-22 deg C, with an approx 35-45% humidity range if possible. Attempt to keep the temp/humidity as constant as possible, and I agree with your idea to get a hygrometer to monitor this. As Colin rightly reminds, keep your piano away from radiators, or any direct heating source - climate control vents etc.

[mdw]

A lot of guarantees exclude damage caused by big temp and humidity swings.

[Kentos1978]

Thanks all and sorry I have not managed to post pics showing the action on the keys experiencing heavy sustain. I am 99.9% confident they do not have dampners - there are no little felt heads as the hammer comes up if that is what you mean? There are still 5 top notes playing with the heavy sustain in this way so it is certainly something I want the tuner to look at. I was a little bit bemused that the dealer did not advise anything particularly being required with temperature and humidity but that aside he has been quite attentive and has called since delivery to see whether I am happy with the purchase. I have just taken delivery of the hygrometer and initial readings suggest about 48-50% humidity and the temp is between 17-18 degrees. Based on what has been said it sounds like I could do with trying to reduce humidity levels although I don't really fancy getting a de-humidifier. Are there any other ways to reduce humidity levels?

[dancarney]

Your humidity levels are fine, don't worry. Your piano will be happy at your current levels.

[Barrie Heaton]

I don't really fancy getting a de-humidifier. Are there any other ways to reduce humidity levels?

A piano life saver but I would hold off till the piano has been tuned before spending good money when you probably don't need to

Barrie

[Colin Nicholson]

Hi

I dont think anyone has said here that the humidity levels should be as little as possible? .... Around the 50% mark is perfect - and your room has the optimum requirements, and all pianos needs a little moisture in the air to prevent wood drying out too much. The temp. is fine also.

The humidity level will vary slightly, depending on the weather - so as long its not raining in your living room, or the temp is about 2 degrees, it will be fine. Humidity tends to affect pianos over a long period of time, where temp. can change things at short notice. Obviously you may want the room a little warmer at times - this is fine, as a new Kawai is built to withstand most temp swings.... however, during the first year or so, the new strings will change pitch.

All pianos have dampers covering about 2/3 of the strings, and the cut-off point varies. The average is about 67 dampers, but I've seen a few pianos with over 70 dampers. The natural acoustics of the piano allow the top treble strings to ring on slightly - since these are much shorter and thinner strings, the sustain is around 5-10 seconds.... as opposed to Middle C which will be over 30 secs. The higher notes with no dampers cannot be changed - nothing you or a tuner can do about it - its the 'natural' sound of the instrument - however, if the odd unison is out of tune, then this may exaggerate the problem you are referring to.

Just like buying a new Ferrari....(I wish!) .... if you don't like the engine noise.... its tough! .... buy a different car.....

Also it may depend on what kind of instrument you have been previously used to?
What kind of piano did you have before this one?
Don't forget also that with the sustain pedal down, even notes not being struck by the hammers will set into vibration by their octave strings - this is just musical physics.

Hope that helps....