Laminated soundboards

[Hansel]

I have noted that budget new pianos often are supplied with laminated soundboards which appear to be the poor relations of the solid spruce variety in terms of sound quality. Some pianos however (eg Venables Studio 120) are described as having solid spruce soundboards with a fine grain veneer. Is this the same as a standard laminated soundboard (with a little applied PR) or is their a genuine difference ?

[Barrie Heaton]

if it has a veneer then its laminated. Baldwin used laminated boards for years on their uprights on their big grand it was solid planks

At the end of the day if the piano sound nice and you like it then the soundboard will last for years

Barrie,

[NewAge]

It tends to be a fairly common misconception that a laminated soundboard is cheap and inferior to a solid core soundboard.
For example some of the higher quality Chinese pianos today use a sold spruce core to give an excellent tone, to which are added specifically designed laminates to the top and bottom to provide stability, consistent performance and durability.
Having worked in Asia and particularly China for a number of years in the Aeronautical industry, it's a fact that quality is an area which is now taken extremely seriously, and this relatively new 'this product will excel' culture is actively being read across to other industries in the higher end-sector.
As Barrie says, ultimately, one should judge a piano by how it sounds.

[sussexpianos]

Mmm, yes, a bit misleading perhaps. There many grades of spruce used for soundboards, a, aa, aaa and also where it comes from, grains per inch etc. Laminated boards are better at climate change and more robust against cracking but will not give the richness of a solid quality board but will be better than a cheap solid board. Most people will not notice the difference as I believe hammers make more of a difference along with good preparation. Some companies refuse to use laminated and others use both.
At the end of the day, its what you like, but personaly I prefere a quality solid board.

[Hansel]

Have now found an answer to my own question coutesy of Larry Fine (reproduced from Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer - Spring 2011)

"Over the past couple of decades better laminated soundboards have been developed, and the pianos into which they've been installed are more advanced, too. The principal new type, known as a "veneer-laminated" or "surface-tension" soundboard, consists of a core of solid spruce (essentially a solid spruce soundboard) covered on both sides by a very thin veneer of spruce. This type of sound-board vibrates much more like a solid one than a plywood one, but still retains the benefit of protection against cracking and loss of crown. Pianos with these soundboards usually sound reasonably good, and occasionally very good. Although solid spruce soundboards may still have a tonal advantage, the laminated feature can be an advantage in durability, particularly in challenging climates, and may contribute to better tuning stability through the annual cycle of seasonal climate changes.

Despite the improvement, you'll generally find these new laminated soundboards only in entry-level or lower mid-range pianos. But the reason for this has less to do with their quality than with marketing: Laminated soundboards are a feature still used by manufacturers to differentiate a lower-cost instrument from a higher-cost one for marketing purposes, even when the laminated one might arguably be better. If you're shopping in the entry-level price range and a piano with a laminated soundboard meets your musical and other expectations, there's no reason not to purchase it."

Hansel

[Barrie Heaton]

Despite the improvement, you'll generally find these new laminated soundboards only in entry-level or lower mid-range pianos. But the reason for this has less to do with their quality than with marketing: Laminated soundboards are a feature still used by manufacturers to differentiate a lower-cost instrument from a higher-cost one for marketing purposes, even when the laminated one might arguably be better. If you're shopping in the entry-level price range and a piano with a laminated soundboard meets your musical and other expectations, there's no reason not to purchase it."

Hansel

This sums it up. However, having not sat in front of a Venables Studio 120 cvan only comment on Laminated form older pianos. Quite a few music schools have the Venables pianos and are very happy with them

Barrie

[Barrie Heaton]

Despite the improvement, you'll generally find these new laminated soundboards only in entry-level or lower mid-range pianos. But the reason for this has less to do with their quality than with marketing: Laminated soundboards are a feature still used by manufacturers to differentiate a lower-cost instrument from a higher-cost one for marketing purposes, even when the laminated one might arguably be better. If you're shopping in the entry-level price range and a piano with a laminated soundboard meets your musical and other expectations, there's no reason not to purchase it."

Hansel

This sums it up. However, having not sat in front of a Venables Studio 120 can only comment on Laminated form older pianos and they ant that bad. Quite a few music schools have the Venables pianos and are very happy with them

Barrie

[sussexpianos]

The laminate debate will go on for many years as the board designs improve. My only real concern is how long will the laminate last? will it de-laminate in time? And also how, if it did crack on an expensive piano, do you repair it as traditional methods will not work? At the end of the day, you make your choice on what you like the sound of.