Tuning Prices in 1920s

[Barrie Heaton]

Some may fine this interesting

Tuning prices in the 1920s

Barrie,

[Bill Kibby]

I must have a more thorough look through this, but it is fascinating that he was prepared to replace a whole set of tapes for 8 dollars - little more than the tuning fee. This suggests that he spent less than one minute per tape. If I come across a piano that is of an age where it needs new tapes, I can usually reckon to spend hours on cleaning and other necessary maintenance while it is taken apart. Perhaps he just hacked them off and used clip-on ones. Was this a man who should be telling America what to charge? Page 18 says London tuners charged 5 shillings, compared to 5-7 dollars!

[Barrie Heaton]

I don't know I just came across it and it look interesting not printed it off yet

Barrie,

[Pianomate]

(it says $5 is for tuning AND regulating.)

I expect $1 would have gone a long way back then.

2d (or 10 cents) would have bought a loaf of bread in 1920

A pint of beer cost about 5d, and milk was about 3d a pint. A 10" popular gramophone record cost about 6d. A bottle of whisky cost 12s 6d.

Average (male) weekly wage was about £5 in 1925. This is about what a skilled tradesman or technician could expect to take home.

The average weekly wage in the USA was about $25, which is comparable. The exchange rate was almost $5 to the £ for much of the 1920s, therefore $1 was worth about 4s (=48d), 1d equating to roughy 2 cents.

For those reading the forum from outside the UK, "d" is the original symbol for old pence (from latin Denarius), of which there were 12 to a shilling (symbol "s" from the latin solidus), of which there were 20 to a pound (£, or l, from the latin "libra" - the system derived from the Troy system of weighing precious metals)

[Bill Kibby]

Do you ignore the regulating when you tune a piano?

[Barrie Heaton]

Average (male) weekly wage was about £5 in 1925. This is about what a skilled tradesman or technician could expect to take home. )

When you put the £5 in relationship with beer or milk to what we make today we are better off but piano tuners have always been well paid.


Barrie

[Barrie Heaton]

Do you ignore the regulating when you tune a piano?

No I was taught that is was part of the visit, but others seem to think not. Visited to many new clients that lost motion is grater than the key depth. having sad that, I do charge grand owners for a service where I take the action apart, clean and re regulate. I do the same for upright owner were I clean the key bed out.



Barrie,

[NewAge]

Average (male) weekly wage was about £5 in 1925. This is about what a skilled tradesman or technician could expect to take home. )

When you put the £5 in relationship with beer or milk to what we make today we are better off but piano tuners have always been well paid. Barrie

For info my quick calc table shows that in 1925, £5 0s 0d would have the same spending worth of today's £150

This Lsd (Pounds/shilling/pence) thing reminds me of a question put to me some 15 years ago by my then French music teacher.
Not knowing too much about the British life and culture, he asked if it was true that in England at one time the monetary system was calculated other than on the decimal system. I replied yes, the English shilling was divided into 12 pence. His jaw dropped! I then added that there were also 20 shillings in the pound. Jaw dropped further! I said that if I ever saved enough pocket money to have half a crown (2s 6d) I felt like I ruled the world – that sum I said, was 30 pennies. Utter confusion on his face! After a moments thought he asked how many pennies there were in the pound. I immediately answered 240. He was gobsmacked! Said something about how could the public possibly make such confusing calculations on a daily basis, and added that surely I must be pulling his leg. I replied I wasn’t, and as a piece de resistance said that racehorses were (and still are) auctioned in guineas, which was equal to 21 shillings. Have you ever seen anybody with a look of utter disbelief?
I can’t remember much about the actual music lesson that day, except to say that the teacher was not his usual self. I’m sure that even today he’s convinced I was winding him up!

For any overseas readers or youngsters who may wish to know more, the following is an interesting site which includes an old/new/year currency converter.
http://www.woodlands-junior.kent.sch.uk ... neyold.htm

[Barrie Heaton]

My first pocket money was 6p my mum use to give me 2 threepenny pieces I started work in 1970 my first take home wage was £5.10 shillings my mum let me keep my fist wage but after that she took half. I was in McDonald a few week ago there was a group of boys in the next table and one was moaning that he had to give him mum £20 a month one of the other boys pointed out that he takes home £600.00 a month and he give his mum £40.00.


Barrie,

[Pianomate]

This Lsd (Pounds/shilling/pence) thing reminds me of a question put to me some 15 years ago by my then French music teacher.
Not knowing too much about the British life and culture, he asked if it was true that in England at one time the monetary system was calculated other than on the decimal system

The French had a non-decimal system prior to the French Revolution.

Also, I seem to remember that there were 18 Denairus to a Solidus, but perhaps I am confusing it with another Roman currency.

2d (or 10 cents) would have bought a loaf of bread in 1920

The cost of living in the USA was higher than in the UK due to inflation.

[vernon]

When I attempted in the early 1960s to rationalise my Dad's tuning round, some of the clients dated to before pre-war. Until I stormed on the scene then it was £10/6/0d for a grand and 7/6d for an upright. I soon sorted that( THAT WAS 55P FOR A GRAND 35 P FOR AN UPRIGHT.
I had an ancient lady customer in Herne Bay up till about 1982 who had been a customer since the 1930's who insisted that only I could tune her crap old joanna and after serving me a glass of cooking sherry with a fly in it assured me she had put the tuning fee"as usual" on the piano. I took 15 shilling(75p) till she died poor old soul

[Pianomate]

The French had a non-decimal system similar to Britain prior to the French Revolution when decimalisation was introduced. 20 sols or sous to the livre, and each sou was made up of 12 deniers. (i.e. again from tha Latin - Libra, Solidus, Denarius)

There were also écus - coins stamped with a shield covered with fleur-de-lys. Their denomination was generally of 3 livres (the écu blanc or louis d’argent introduced in 1641), or 6 livres (an écu d’armes introduced in 1727). On occasion, the face value of the écu blanc (the number of livres and sous it represented) was varied from month to month.

You may remember that before the Euro, there was talk of the European unit of currency to be called the ECU, but this was dropped so that it could not be viewed as favouring one particular language.

Likewise weights were The livre was the principal unit of weight (489.506 grams), One Livre was equivalent to 2 marks or 16 onces.

There were also archaic forms of measurement of length, area, capacity.

[NewAge]

There were also écus - coins stamped with a shield covered with fleur-de-lys........
You may remember that before the Euro, there was talk of the European unit of currency to be called the ECU, but this was dropped so that it could not be viewed as favouring one particular language.

Quite right about about the écu also being the name of an ancient French coin and that was one (perhaps the main) reason that a new name had to be devised for its successor currency the Euro - no favouritism.
The additional problem was that the name écu was similar in pronunciation to the German phrases "ein ECU" (an ECU) and "eine Kuh" (a cow).
I mean, we in Britain didn't used to mind 'spending a penny', but for the Germans to go and spend a cow.........somewhat degrading methinks.

[Bill Kibby]

I think we have forgotten what the subject was, but that's forums for you! I am puzzled by Vernon's suggestion that the prices could have been £10.6s for a grand and 7/6d for an upright. Shouldn't that be 10/6 and 7/6?

[vernon]

ill
sorry to puzzle you. I didn't have a slash in the right place!

[Gill the Piano]

From 'Good Omens' by Terry Pratchett & Neil Gaiman
"NOTE FOR YOUNG PEOPLE & AMERICANS: One shilling = five pee.It helps...if you know the original British monetary system:
Two fathings = One Ha'penny. Two ha'pennies = One Penny. Three pennies = A Thrupenny Bit. Two Thruppences = A Sixpence.Two Sixpences = A Shilling, or A Bob. Two Bob = A Florin. One Florin and One Sixpence = Half A Crown. Four Half Crowns = A Ten Bob Note. Two Ten Bob Notes = A Pound (or 240 Pennies). One Pound and One Shilling = A Guinea.
The British resisted decimalised currency for a long time because they thought it was Too Complicated."

[pianobrereton]

I still prefer it ! and I still measure in imperial .
In France they still use the old Ib measurements at markets . Though I dont think that they get prosecuted for it like we do here by the thought police .

[athomik]

In Germany, the pound is in general use (or was when I lived there in the 1960/70's). But a German pound is 500grammes.

[Pianomate]

In France they still use the old Ib measurements at markets

NO! - The lbs or "livres métrique" used in French markets are "new pounds" at 500 grams and are not the same as the pre-revolution "livre poids de marc" which were equivalent to about 489.5 grammes. If they started trading in "livres poids de marc" they would get prosecuted.

But a German pound is 500grammes

The German "Pfund" was originally 467 grammes in Berlin, but could very between the German States, then an official decree in 1854 stated that it must equal 500 grammes.



The main country which continues to use non-metric units is of course the USA. Their pounds are the avoirdupois pounds the same as the UK. However the USA uses "Short Tons" at 2000lb as opposed to 2240lb. Also a US pint is 16floz whereas an Imperial pint is 20floz, hence a US gallon is 4/5 the size of a UK gallon. I found it interesting when I was over there a couple of years ago that the children where I was staying had no concept of how long a kilometre was, or how much a kilogram weighed.

[NewAge]

The main country which continues to use non-metric units is of course the USA. Their pounds are the avoirdupois pounds the same as the UK. However the USA uses "Short Tons" at 2000lb as opposed to 2240lb. Also a US pint is 16floz whereas an Imperial pint is 20floz, hence a US gallon is 4/5 the size of a UK gallon. I found it interesting when I was over there a couple of years ago that the children where I was staying had no concept of how long a kilometre was, or how much a kilogram weighed.

As Bill so rightly said, it's difficult not to keep to the subject matter........
And being a piano and aviation enthusiast, the above reminds me of severe consequences of mixed measuring systems.
- In 1983, a Canadian Boeing 767 jet ran out of fuel in mid-flight because of two mistakes in figuring the fuel supply of the first aircraft to use metric measurements. After both engines lost power, the pilots made what is now thought to be the first successful emergency dead stick landing of a commercial jetliner.
- In 1999 NASA lost a $125 million Mars orbiter because one engineering team used metric units while another used US customary units for a calculation.

Oh, and while we're on the subject of conversion, I'm sure everyone knows that:-
10 millepedes = 1 centipede, and
1/2 lavatory = 1 demijohn

[Pianomate]

I remember being told that there were similar mistakes during WW2 with fuel in US gallons versus Imperial gallons, though I expect the GIs were happy with their pints of beer being 25% bigger!

mistakes in figuring the fuel supply of the first aircraft to use metric measurements

Such incidents are avoided by always using the correct nomeclature and suffixes - eg US Gall, Imp Gall, L, and NEVER omitting them from any numbers or calculations.

[Gill the Piano]

I heard the recent Beagle thingy to Mars failed beacuse of insistence on foreign measurements instead of imperial, too...
And I have no concerpt of what a kilometre is either. I haven't forgiven them for messing with my head at school..."Right, can everyone times, divide, add and subtract in pounds, shillings, pence, feet and inches?"
"Yes, Mrs O'Connor."
"Well they're changing it."
"AAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!"

[athomik]

Most worryingly, if you ask for a large beer in Germany (not at the Oktoberfest), you never know if you're going to get 0.3l or 0.4l. (unless you ask for "ein Halbes", in which case you get 0.5l)

[pianobrereton]

I too have no concept of what a killometre or a millimetre is and I have no intention of learning.
It's been part of our culture for hundreds of years and I for one value my culture and will not be giving it up to some unelected unwanted european superstate . WHERE's OUR REFERENDUM !

[Gill the Piano]

Hear hear....I'm voting for you, PB!

[Barrie Heaton]

I too have no concept of what a killometre or a millimetre is and I have no intention of learning.

We put the satnav on metric but keep missing the turning so its back on miles

I
It's been part of our culture for hundreds of years and I for one value my culture and will not be giving it up to some unelected unwanted european superstate . WHERE's OUR REFERENDUM !

So was Hanging but we got rid of that, I bet if we had a referendum that would come back but the EEC will stay in its new dictatorial form once ratified.

Barrie,

[pianobrereton]

[quote="Barrie Heaton"]So was Hanging but we got rid of that, I bet if we had a referendum that would come back but the EEC will stay in its new dictatorial form once ratified.



Bringing hanging back would be a great move we could hang all the politicians who commited treason by signing away our liberties to an unelected , undemocratic state . I would gladly supply all the piano wire to do it with ,so it's done properly you understand .
By the way Tony Blair removed the offence of treason from the statute books ........ wonder why !

[Barrie Heaton]

By the way Tony Blair removed the offence of treason from the statute books ........ wonder why !

Treason Act 1351 is incompatible with the Human Rights Act "The Human Rights Act 1998 enshrines freedom of expression" but was it not just amended.

Barrie

[Pianomate]

The Human Rights Act is of course the Terrorists' and Criminals' Charter!! The thing they all hide behind when found out!
The sooner it is repealed the better!