Chopin - fantasie impromptu, any tips?

[Gooday]

Started having a look at this. I don't seriously expect to play the whole piece any time soon, but it looks like good practice for 4 against 3 patterns.

So, any tips? I'm trying a few approaches but things are still sounding a bit lumpy.

First approach, tapping out the rhythm and trying to 'program' it in my head.

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 1
L - - - L - - - L - - - L etc.
R - - R - - R - - R - - R

(actually, using 1 & 2 & up to 6 &, but it's the same thing.)

Then I'm playing the left hand of bar 5 slowly, 3 notes to a beat (I'm using 4 per bar to line things up temporarily). Likewise, righthand, 4 notes Adding them together... and getting lumpiness.

early days - I can run through the first 2 pages slowly, but key is that 4 vs 3 I think.


Any help much appreciated (unless it's to refer me to my music teacher...)

[Gooday]

rhythm hasn't lined up properly, that's LH on 1,5,9 and RH 1,4,7,10

[Stuart]

For what it's worth, Tovey commented about a 2 against 3 rhythm in a Beethoven sonata - can't remember which one - that it's not a problem as it's played fast. Playing 2 against 3, 3 against 4 etc slowly is a problem. Now, in itself this may not be helpful, but if you practice each hand separately - no timing problems then - until each hand really knows the notes, then put them together at a moderate speed, you may find they come together almost automatically because each hand really knows what it should be doing and just does it. I say 'may find', as some passages can only be practised with both hands right from the word go. But certainly in my practice of the Fantasie Impromptu, the cross rhythms are not the the major problem. A clean RH in bars 37 - 40 (Fontana edition) and the corresponding passage later, plus bars 121 - 124 (again Fontana edition - this passage is easier in the manuscript edition, but I started with the Fontana!) are the 2 worst spots for me. Wonderful piece to study. Good luck.

[Gooday]

Thanks Stuart. Spent another hour or so on the piece this weekend and things are beginning to click. Occassionally I can get through to bar 13 at third speed with hands to gether and it's sounds okay which is great because I'll be able to speed up gradually. I'm also putting in some occasional higher speed cycles. The rh patterns of bar 13 seem to line up naturally with lh when played at higher speed so that approach seems to work better there and must say those bars sound impressive (much easier than they sound.) I'm beginning to think I might even be able to play this some day...

regarding 2 against 3, once you've heard the rythym once it's fairly easy to play at any speed I think. 4 against 3, less so at high speed hence my initial difficulties.

[Gooday]

I don't know - bars 37-41 seem fairly comfortable even at speed, but I've got longish fingers so maybe that helps. Worst so far are 17-22 where I keep finding notes that shouldn't line up, lining up but getting there. Maybe if i ever finish it I'll put it on youtube and show the steps taken.Actually there are some horrible, if technically impressive, versions on youtube. Some people can spend months working on a piece but never actually listen to what they're playing it seems. Speed isn't everything!