Preparation of new pianos

[NewAge]

I recall reading that one dealer in the US claims to perform a basic preparation on every grand piano he sells - this initially comprising some 20 checks and regulations, followed by a further 15 checks/ adjustment, and finally a total of 8 checks/regulation on the 3 pedals. An estimated time of approx 20 (twenty!) hours being claimed for this work – yep, on every grand piano he sells. Other dealers, but certainly not all have characterized this as normal ‘basic prep’ needed by all pianos.
I would welcome the comments of UK dealers regarding this.

I would guess that if a buyer agreed on the price of an expensive piano (or even a medium-priced upright) without mentioning any specific prep he required, the dealer would sell a minimally prepped instrument. Is this correct? And if so how do you define your minimal prep and approx time to complete?
I would assume that most piano customers don’t demand any specific level of preparation or service, and therefore don’t get it.

The piano business like most others must be governed by supply and demand, and the manufacturer must control the cost of production in order to remain competitive – especially in these current troubled times. I should imagine that as a result of this at the factory, short-cuts are regularly taken in the general set-up of many pianos. This was certainly the case with the brand new ‘better-named’ grand piano that I tried recently - a real dog, and worse still the dealer didn't give a hoot and exhibited on his stand at a trade fair!

[chrisvenables]

Not many dealers will want to answer this one NewAge! Any dealer reply is just asking for trouble, but here goes.

20 hours (3 working days) to prep a new piano? He's obviously a very slow worker and at that rate isn't going to make a fortune. (which reminds me of the old joke about 'How do you make a small fortune in the piano business? Start off with a large one!)

'Checking' can take minutes, 'adjusting' can take hours, so much depends on how thorough the manufacturer is with the prep at the factory, how the temperature and humidity levels fluctuate between the factory and the dealer. Plus sometimes there's an additional move if a distibutor is involved. And how long the piano has been left on its side, (in the case of a grand) in a warehouse before delivery to the dealer. So there's no one answer to the question. Pianos are sensitive creatures: I took a concert pianist to Germany to select a new concert grand for a music school. The artist was so impressed with the piano, he asked if he could use it before it was delivered to the school to record a new cd. The school agreed. Bearing in mind he had selected the piano, superbly prep'd from their selection room, it was delivered within days to EMI 's Abbey Rd in London for the recording. When we arrived to tune, the action was sluggish and the day's session was cancelled as the entire action needed recentering!

Efficiency and experience are the keys. eg The tuning process can be used to included checking SOME areas of the regulation and, if you've ever seen a video of how a piano is made using Japanese techniques you will be stunned at the speed at which they work - and how accurate and efficient they are. With apologies to PG for using a motor anology, watch a wheel change at a grand prix or even at your local Kwik fit. Just because somebody takes longer to prep a piano doesn't mean they've prepped it better.

Some pianos are received into our warehouse and some directly into our showrooms. They may be tuned and prep'd or sometimes just checked and tuned in the showroom before selection, depending on the factory prep. So some instruments may receive 2 preps (one before selection and one after) and several tunings depending on how quickly it takes to sell, some only one. In the same way that an expensive grand will receive more attention in the factory than a budget upright, the same applies with prepping in the showroom or warehouse. I am open and honest about this - but even the budget upright has to be prep'd and fine tuned before delivery. There's no sense in delivering an unprep'd piano to a customer 150 miles away and then having to pay an outside technician £150 to regulate or recentre the action when we can do the work in-store for half the price. Customers who select even a budget piano can have their piano custom prep'd and voiced to any level of mellowness or brilliance they wish at no extra charge. Some customers believe in the 'fresh out of the box' approach and are actually suspicious about having a piano 'voiced' and then some want the showroom model, complete with extra voicing etc. We respect their decision.

Factory short cuts in production and prepping: - one reason we inspect the piano as soon as we can after delivery is that if we discover it is not up to standard, then we just return it to the manufacturer. That way we usually receive decent stock.

An observation from the dealer's point of view ( and probably most tuners would second this): Customers are keen to have their piano tuned and carefully prep'd when new but few ever pay to have them serviced thereafter. The piano handbook which comes with most new pianos stresses regular tuning and servicing to keep your piano in prime condition (say 6 monthly tuning and servicing every 2 years for domestic, and every year for schools) How many piano owners have had their piano serviced and how often? NewAge?

[Stuart]

Experts on this forum have many times stressed the need to buy only the piano you have tried in the showroom, not another one out of the warehouse, off the ship etc - so any dealer who expects this requirement from customers will have prepped each piano at least adequately. (Any that don't should be given a wide berth) But what sounds wonderful in the showroom acoustics may sound very different at home: considerably duller or considerably brighter. (I've been there ) I would advise anyone who cares about how their new piano will sound to request, if necessary, a follow up check/voicing so that the instrument sounds at its best in its permanent home. As Chris points out, pianos can be affected by the move anyway. A follow up of this sort - not just a first tune - may or may not be free but may make the difference between this and this or even this

[chrisvenables]

Excellent comment Stuart. I thought my reply was so long it had gone well past its expiry date but, yes, acoustics play a major part in the selection process. I would also recommend customers to try the actual piano they buy - some who buy blind and find that they're unhappy with the tone blame it on lack of prepping, when it's more than likely because they didn't select it personally from the dealer's showroom. It doesn't cost a customer any extra, so why not do it? This week we have had customers from Holland and Ireland fly to us to select. It's usually the purchase of a lifetime, so surely it's worth a day of the customer's time?

Any customer who buys from us is asked what the acoustic quality is like in the room where the piano is being installed. We have rooms with hard floors and with carpeted floors, bright acoustics and dry acoustics. We always ask the discerning customer to give us an idea of the size of their room, the type of acoustic, hard floor, carpeted floor, soft furnishings, etc., so we can tone the piano to the acoustic of the customer's room. Using this formula, we have almost never had a customer ask us to re-voice a piano after delivery. If they want it re-voiced, within a few weeks of delivery, we will oblige, free of charge.

I love your graphics too!

[NewAge]

Chris,
I admire your courage in providing an answer, and feel it’s a pity that other professionals had no desire to share their opinions, in fact the absence of additional feed-back from others may well be interpreted as suspect. I certainly had no intention in opening up a pandora’s box when originating this query, and I now realise that this could be a very sensitive topic within the profession for whatever reason..........

I thank you for your interesting, candid comments, which imho says a great deal for your integrity.
You mention, “Customers are keen to have their piano tuned and carefully prep'd when new but few ever pay to have them serviced thereafter”.
I agree with you, believing this to be generally true.

In my particular case however, my Sauter which is just over one year old has had two ‘free’ in-home tunings, plus a further two from my wallet.
As this piano was as important a purchase as a new car (of which I negotiated an extended warranty to 5 years), I also intend to have the piano maintained in accordance with the handbook, although I was surprised to see that whilst there is a section which allows for record keeping of all maintenance, there are no details of what should specifically be checked, or at what intervals. I intend to follow this up with my local dealer.
Again, thank you for your comments, and keep your posts coming – I certainly enjoy sharing from your experience.
Stuart too, appreciated your comments.

[chrisvenables]

As this piano was as important a purchase as a new car (of which I negotiated an extended warranty to 5 years), I also intend to have the piano maintained in accordance with the handbook, although I was surprised to see that whilst there is a section which allows for record keeping of all maintenance, there are no details of what should specifically be checked, or at what intervals. I intend to follow this up with my local dealer.

The following is a rough guide to servicing procedures, post delivery, which you may want to compare with those of your local dealer: (Order of work varies from one manufacturer to another)

Tune, reface hammers, tone, lube, screw tightening, regulate, including pedals. Fine tune and fine tone. Regulation includes:

Ease keys
Space whippens
Set jacks
Align hammers
Keyframe height, sit and domes
Straighten, level and space keys
Hammer blow and line
Set off
Key touch depth
Dampers sit, lift and damper mechanism
Repetition and drop
Backchecks
Weight
Una corda and keyboard shift

PS. Thanks for your kind comments - Sauters are great pianos. I first met Carl Sauter and his wife about 20 years ago - very natural, nice people. Unusual in the rather conservative industry of piano manufacturing, but he wore an earing! When Christmas came around, I received a wooden box about 20" X 8" X 5" throught the post with a festive card. A silk tie, shirt or scarfe maybe? My excitement was soon dashed upon opening. Inside, vacuum wrapped, were a pair of the largest German kippers I've ever seen!

[PianoGuy]

Inside, vacuum wrapped, were a pair of the largest German kippers I've ever seen!

Done up like a kipper in fact.

[chrisvenables]

Inside, vacuum wrapped, were a pair of the largest German kippers I've ever seen!

Done up like a kipper in fact.

P G; I don't think piano forum is the plaice for puns relating to aquatic vertebrates - Carp, sorry Carl Sauter had been fishing around UK dealers who had only been dab bling at selling his goods until he met me. I was already hooked on German pianos as my sales of English brands were floundering. He musselled in to my dealership with stories about other makos being in trouble, (which I later found to be a red herring), said how good the bass was on a Sauter and played me a scale or two. (He had a halibut of demonstrating his pianos that way). The walnut polyester fin ish was impressive. I thought he was spinning me a line, but I still took the bait. He bought me lunch, it was hot, and I was feeling clammy. We had a whale of a time but I didn't plaice any more orders which is why I got the box of kippers for Christmas. I don't think eel ever be back, especially when I underpaid his last invoice by sixtysix squid.

[NewAge]

Excellent!
Don't tell me! You composed this whilst you were down at the quay (key?) side ............

[chrisvenables]

Yes at the quayside indeed. I've just been trawling through an absolute shoal of private messages - there's one from Carl Sauter - he said in spite of what I wrote, he doesn't harbour any grudge. No pier pressure either.

[mdw]

Can you think of any other trade that sends out half finished product for the retailer to sort out before its sold?

[Stuart]

I've never been in the retail part of the car trade but I believe new car dealers have quite a lot of 'prepping' to do before the customer picks up his shiny new motor. I've never been a piano dealer either but as a relatively seasoned customer who still makes mistakes, , and someone who has been involved in moving instruments and playing them having moved them, I can vouch for several things. One, every piano is different, each market is different, each (discerning ) customer is different. So it makes sense for a dealer to check what may have happened during shipment and prep a piano for his expected market taste and for the acoustics of his showroom, in order to demonstrate the instrument to its best advantage. Then, if the said discerning customer wants further tweaking after delivery, a good dealer will oblige.
It may sound precious, but musical instruments are individual and their characterisics are affected by their surroundings and even when not moved, changes in humidity not only $*&^$£ the tuning, but the sound. Dry wood resonates differently from moist wood for example. The different materials react differently to changes in temperature and humidity. A good technician, whether the dealer or your own afterwards, will be sensitive to how the patient, sorry, piano, is and adjusts both the piano and his approach accordingly.

[genaa]

Isn't Ulrich the one with the earring ? (or should that be herring unless I am also floundering with my suggestion

[chrisvenables]

The moderator should issue a 'caviart' - no more fishy puns.

A tip if you're a piano tuna - continuous, loud, hard, tuning can damage your hearing. An ear nose and throat sturgeon told me that.

[Bob Pierce]

Oh Chris you are talking bobbins! Dealers these days do not spend the time in setting up the instruments as it eats into the profit margin.

[chrisvenables]

Profit margin? What's that?

[sussexpianos]

Its what Yamaha dealers are asking!!!!! lol