Piano lesson fees?

cwilson · Post by **cwilson** » 07 Oct 2003, 11:23

I'm going to get piano lessons for 6 pounds a lesson. I was actually quite shocked at how cheap it was - I was thinking it was much more. Are most piano lessons about this price?

Post by **Barrie Heaton** » 07 Oct 2003, 12:21

cwilson wrote: Are most piano lessons about this price?

That depends where you live here in Darwen 8.00 to 10 pounds but down the road in Bolton it is about 10 to 15 for half an hour. Down south U would not get a teacher out of bed for that

cwilson · Post by **cwilson** » 07 Oct 2003, 16:49

Yes there tends to be more people playing piano down south anyway. I live in Darlington up north, in the North Yorkshire area. There aren't many piano players here and certainly not many teachers. The lady whom I called was one of about 2 in this area. I'm lucky that they're so cheap or I would not be able to afford them.

Steve071261 · Post by **Steve071261** » 16 May 2004, 14:15

Hi,

I pay &25 an hour, and I tend to have a full hour every couple of weeks. This suits me more than a half-hour every week as sometimes my opportunities to practise can be erratic, and we cover much more in an hour than half an hour.

I think what you pay may depend on the qualifications of your teacher. An amateur teacher, without professional recognistion (teaching diplomas etc) would not be able to command the sort of rates of a teacher affiliated to one of the recogniosed music schools, but equally what that teacher was able to give you, in terms of recognised grades, etc, might be more limited.

If you're a beginner, that's not a problem of course, but if you're getting more serious, and you want some objective measurement of your piano playing, the doing the grade exams is the most obvious route, and you might find this costs more.

If your teacher is qualified and recognised, of course, then please disregard all the above

littlemisscrotchet · Post by **littlemisscrotchet** » 10 Jan 2005, 21:50

It can go as high as &16 for 1/2 an hour up here! I'm paying (well my parents) a little over &13 for 1/2 an hour and it's going up!
Well known professionals can charge what they like since they are so good and teaching you!
Sheena

yourforte · Post by **yourforte** » 13 Oct 2008, 16:25

I live and teach in Darlington. The average price for piano lessons up here is way more than £6. There's the odd unqualified person giving very cheap lessons but, in general, you get what you pay for. I charge £9 for half an hour and even that's cheap - bearing in mind I've got 3 degrees, 2 of which are in music. You can find average prices by going on various sites that you'll find on Google. I'd be wary of anyone charging only £6 - either they're not qualified and/or inexperienced, or they're wanting a few extra coppers on top of the wage that they're already getting for another job. £25-£30 an hour is probably the going rate. Mm.. must put my own prices up..

All the best to you,
Elaine

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 14 Oct 2008, 09:34

I charge £15 for half an hour and £30 for an hour. I offer no discounts for siblings learning and I charge for missed lessons. I don't offer discounts such as buy 10 lessons for the price of 8. If people want to learn they'll pay it.

I know of some teachers in this world who are charging the same and their qualification is 'Grade 6 with distinction'. As if.....

yourforte · Post by **yourforte** » 14 Oct 2008, 10:08

Well I wish all roads did lead to Darlo...

I agree with what Joseph says actually. I've started to charge for missed lessons and I don't do discounts for 'bulk' lessons either. I often find that the parents of more than one child who are having lessons also want a cheaper rate. I won't lesson my prices for families who learn either. My experience is that you only lose out as a teacher if you teach two or three from one family - they all take their holidays at the same time, they all go to the cinema at the same time, they all have the flu at the same time, etc etc.

I think what you say, Joseph, is exactly right. I think your fees are probably very reasonable for where you live. I think if I charged £15 for half an hour in this town then I'd lose all custom. But as I say, I am indeed in 'competition' with people teaching who've only got a Grade 4 themselves. If people ring up about lessons and their first question is, 'how much is it?" then I'm on a loser.

But as a matter of principle I don't want to charge too much. Some of my most able pupils are from less affluent backgrounds and I don't want to make it impossible for that sort of person to learn.

Elaine

yourforte · Post by **yourforte** » 14 Oct 2008, 17:02

Come North young man...

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 14 Oct 2008, 17:26

piano teachers have to earn a decent living. I studied for the same length of time as a doctor or a lawyer (my brother is a lawyer in London so I know what they go through) and yet we have to scrape away for money.

On average a private teacher would give 35 lessons a year, and with any luck would be teaching about 30 hours a week. By the time you prepare lessons, practise, swat up for your pupils, research repertoire and go out to buy their books you're easily into 40 hours a week.

So the sum 30 (pounds) times 30 hours times 35 weeks is 31500 per year. Thats a best case scenario. Ok a lawyer will start on £15000 for a traineeship, then it will jump to £26000 in the first year and rise in increments from there. Its not long before the lawyer has far outstripped the piano teacher. The lawyer also knows they're going to be paid! They don't have to cope with students dropping out, etc.

My brother earns £200K a year, and we are qualified to the same level in our field. Incidentally I don't earn anything like £31 500 a year, WAY LESS than that sadly.

Also, considering that private teachers have to teach out of hours, its a terrible wage really. No social life.

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 14 Oct 2008, 17:28

Not to mention the running costs, buying a piano, tunings (do you know how difficult and expensive it is to get a decent tech in Scotland!?) etc etc etc.

Labour of love I think!

Descombes · Post by **Descombes** » 14 Oct 2008, 17:56

I agree that (certainly in this area) £30 an hour seems reasonable.

To continue Joseph's comparisons, I recently broached the subject of Personal Training with one of the instructors at my local Gym. His rates were £30 an hour + travelling, which seemed about what I would expect. Then I thought about the comparison. He's a very skilled and well-qualified young man, but I imagine his qualifications involved courses lasting months not years, whereas mine took about five years.

yourforte · Post by **yourforte** » 14 Oct 2008, 19:12

Well Darlington isn't that far from Whitby...

Oh it gets on my nerves when people think we private teachers are out of order to expect to earn a decent living. I studied O level music then A level music then I spent 5yrs at university studying music - so, yes, I do expect to earn more than an untrained person in any field. The thing about musicians is that they make it look easy - when (if it IS easy) it's only easy because you've undergone so much training. And the other thing is that people think that music's nice and that therefore you shouldn't be paid very much because you're doing something that's NICE. Yes, there have been many times when I wish I'd gone into law or medicine instead of music. Although, whenever a doctor is being patronising towards me, I think keep it in the front of my mind that they would probably be incapable of playing the piano even if they tried.

Yes, it's hard to strike a balance between charging as much as you (bigheadedly) think you're worth as a teacher and allowing lessons to be accessible to the less well off people who can't afford to pay that much. Because, if there's one thing I've learnt over my music teaching career, money can't buy you an innate ability. I've got relatively poor pupils who are good and I've got some rich ones who are bad (although I wouldn't want to generalise). There does tend to be a bit of an 'attitude' from rich parents though.

BFN, Elaine

yourforte · Post by **yourforte** » 14 Oct 2008, 22:42

Yes, quite right, Dave. I do feel kind of caught in between matters of conscience but my own desire (and need) to earn a decent living.

Yes, yes, there are plenty of 'spoilt brats' having lessons just because their parents have a lot of money. They're blummin cheeky too. And it kills me when I see a gorgeous Blüthner baby grand being bought by a rich man for his daughter who'll never be able to play in a month of Sundays.

What sort of music do you play on the piano, Dave? What sort of music do you like?

Elaine

louttrim · Post by **louttrim** » 15 Oct 2008, 18:27

hello

I pay £20 an hour for mine.. don't know what her qualifications are, just saw her ad in the yellow pages. We suit each other though, I reckon she's a star!

Lx

Moonlight · Post by **Moonlight** » 15 Oct 2008, 20:21

For the lesson I had today I had to pay 12.50 for half an hour, or it would be 25 for an hour.

I'm beginning to think it would be better to go to a less qualifed teacher that I just click with then a qualifed teacher that I don't have that chemistry with

...

Looks like I might shop around for a teacher...

Katmid · Post by **Katmid** » 17 Oct 2008, 13:34

I found my piano tutor right here on UK Piano!

She charges £9 for a half hour, or £15 for an hour (I think that was it anyway... I find half an hour is enough!) and I really like her! I can't remember her qualifications off the top of my head, but I find her very patient and she has a really good calming influence so I never feel frustrated even though I stuff up ALL the time!

Conversely, a friend of mine was paying £12 for a half hour. Her tutor is one recommended by the school that her sister goes to (She is 17, her sister is 15) and she hated him. He was impatient and put a lot of pressure on her so that she didn't enjoy herself. Sadly, I think he might've completely scared her away from learning to play.

Just goes to show that it takes all sorts! Obviously, if you're looking to work through the grades, especially the higher grades then qualifications will matter, but perhaps, if you are at a fairly low level and not sure how far you're going to go, or you're not going to do exams, it's more important to find someone that you gel with!

Moonlight · Post by **Moonlight** » 17 Oct 2008, 14:19

Katmid wrote:can't remember her qualifications off the top of my head, but I find her very patient and she has a really good calming influence so I never feel frustrated even though I stuff up ALL the time!

I don't even know anything about my teacher's qualifications because it all seemed a little rushed, and I'm not having lessons in her home. So the atmosphere is not relaxing and I didn't feel calm!

. After I left I didn't feel that happy.

Katmid wrote:if you're looking to work through the grades, especially the higher grades then qualifications will matter

Yeah, but If I find a nice teacher with say only grade 6 then theres still LOADS to learn from them until I reach that level. Gosh, if I were that level I would play Chopin every day!

Nutroast · Post by **Nutroast** » 17 Oct 2008, 15:14

Hi Anna,

Firstly, I'm really sorry you've been left feeling a little flat after your much longed-for piano lesson. For what is't worth, I pay 10.50 for a half hour and it's worth every penny. A lesson should leave you excited and fired up about what you want to do for next time and what you've learnt. I think you should definitely look for another teacher if you're not happy, it's your money and time. I'm sure your teacher is fine, but if you don't click, then it will be hard for both of you

I found out yesterday that my teacher had grade 8 before she left school

OH, to be that good

She then went on further with it too at the RAM and has spent many years teaching since then. I wonder if being that good at an instrument spoils your enjoyment of listening to live music, just to know you can sound just as good in your own living room! What a joy.

Good luck Hun, I'd hate to see you lose your enthusiasm.

Jan
xx

Katmid · Post by **Katmid** » 17 Oct 2008, 15:47

Good advice there, Nutroast! It is your time and money and if you don't click with your tutor they probably find the relationship just a tough from their side too.

You'll find someone that's perfect eventually, Moonlight!

Moonlight · Post by **Moonlight** » 17 Oct 2008, 17:38

Thanks guys for your support!

Yeah, you guys are right. You spend the money, and if its not quite what you want move on and find someone more suitable. I do feel rather sorry for poor kids that have to go because their parents want them to, they have no say.

I have already contacted another teacher today, and I could read something about her so all sounds good. I await her reply...

*watch this space*

Descombes · Post by **Descombes** » 17 Oct 2008, 19:09

Moonlight wrote:
Yeah, but If I find a nice teacher with say only grade 6 then theres still LOADS to learn from them until I reach that level. Gosh, if I were that level I would play Chopin every day!

I know I've got to phrase this carefully if I am to avoid making some mystique out of the business of teaching!

BUT.......Grade 6, say, only demonstrates someone's ability to play the piano to a certain level. It says nothing about teaching ability! Some people are natural teachers, but even they need to study all the techniques, methods, etc which are included in a teaching qualification. It really is worth looking for a qualified teacher!

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 17 Oct 2008, 21:40

i tell you what though, theres nothing like teaching for learning how to teach!

You need to know what you're aiming for etc etc.

markymark · Post by **markymark** » 18 Oct 2008, 12:38

They may have the technique for Grade 6 but what about the other stuff; I wonder would a typical Grade 6 piano player be able to tell you about assessment techniques, target setting, short-term, medium term and long term planning, target setting, planning or assessment for learning?

Even general material about the history of western music (medieval, renaissance, baroque, classical, romantic, 20th century, abstract and postmodernist music) salient features that go with each era it are also important and imform the way you teach and what you are teaching to a pupil.

As a result, you will find others on the forum saying that a Grade student should only teach upto 2 or 3 grades away from their level. So the Grade 6 player shouldn't really consider going higher than Grade 3/4 which I would strongly agree with. As Descombes says there are people who are natural teachers and could teach Grade 8 although they only hold Grade 8 themselves, but in these cases, I suspect that they have abilities that truly surpass that label anyway. It has to be said, however, that this would be the exception as opposed to the rule.

Descombes · Post by **Descombes** » 18 Oct 2008, 13:51

markymark wrote:They may have the technique for Grade 6 but what about the other stuff; I wonder would a typical Grade 6 piano player be able to tell you about assessment techniques, target setting, short-term, medium term and long term planning, target setting, planning or assessment for learning?

Even general material about the history of western music (medieval, renaissance, baroque, classical, romantic, 20th century, abstract and postmodernist music) salient features that go with each era it are also important and imform the way you teach and what you are teaching to a pupil.

As a result, you will find others on the forum saying that a Grade student should only teach upto 2 or 3 grades away from their level. So the Grade 6 player shouldn't really consider going higher than Grade 3/4 which I would strongly agree with.

I would go further and say that a qualified teacher is even more important at the early stages than at an advanced stage. Every teacher has come across pupils who have been inadequately taught as beginners. They have learnt pieces parrot-fashion, with little idea of reading notation, so as a result they can't sight-read. Their basic technique is often faulty and has to be re-learnt before further progress can be made; and there has rarely been any attempt to teach basic musicianship or to develop the ear.

I know that Grade 6 sounds an immense achievement when you are struggling at lower grades, but it is still a comparatively low level of attainment when thinking of the skills necessary for a teacher. How many people would be happy if their children were being taught in primary schools by people with qualifications no higher than GCSE? It really is a similar situation.

There are plenty of qualified teachers around. Children (and adults) should be paid the compliment of being given high calibre tuition.

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 18 Oct 2008, 16:01

YES DES ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!!!!

The most important teacher you will have is the one that guides you in your earliest years. So much time is spent in conservatoires undoing the bad teaching of lesser qualified teachers!

Really, if you are going to have the best possible chance then you need to have the best teacher from the outset. If you go to a bad teacher (I know of teachers in my area with no qualification other than they think they can do it and I have seen the results - makes me sad) then you can be certain that you'll only ever be a hobbyist at the most, unless you are prepared to work doubly hard when you are older which is possible but so tiring.

Moonlight · Post by **Moonlight** » 18 Oct 2008, 18:05

...

Sorry guys, I didn't mean to strike such a chord with you teachers. Its just my ignorance on the subject as I work in a completly different area to you lot.

What I meant was, as I'm a beginner I still have a lot to learn and even a 'teacher' with a lower grade would be good for me at least to get started. I'm an adult learner so I'm not too serious about becoming amazing at the piano, I have missed my boat for that. If I had kids and wanted them to become proper pianists then I would try to find the best teacher I could.

I do agree with you guys. Obviously if one has the choice to find a teacher they get on with, that is qualified; then thats excellent. But for some people it might be difficult to find a teacher ( they like ) with all the qualifications. What are they to do? give up at the piano?

I have read other people's stories about how they had a teacher they didn't get on with, ( yeah the teacher might have all the qualifications )
the teacher should never make the pupil feel put off by the subject they are learning, but make the pupil feel even more enthusiastic about it.

These are just some of my thoughts, whether they are valid I don't know.

Having said all that, the teacher I contacted is a qualified teacher, so hopefuly no worries!

Descombes · Post by **Descombes** » 18 Oct 2008, 21:07

Hi Moonlight
I was thinking about you before my rant about qualified teachers and so I was reluctant to have my say. I can see that there are people in your situation who, for whatever reason, cannot get lessons from a proper teacher.
So yes, I agree that someone who can play the piano and can teach you the basics is better than nothing at all.
Having said that, I'm sure you will benefit from going to a fully qualified person and I'm really pleased that you've found someone. I hope you will keep us up to date with your progress.

Learning the piano is a long process, but the work is worth it in the long run, and I can see that you have got the enthusiasm to stick at it. (Sorry if I sound a bit like a school report; I've written too many of them over the years!)

Moonlight · Post by **Moonlight** » 19 Oct 2008, 19:05

Hi Descombes,

Yes I will definitely keep you people up to date with my progress! Its nice to find a site were we can talk to other piano enthusiasts from all backgrounds, and its interesting to see others peoples views on the subject.

And no, you don't sound like a school report!

williamhhay · Post by **williamhhay** » 30 Oct 2008, 12:18

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:26 pm Post subject:
piano teachers have to earn a decent living. I studied for the same length of time as a doctor or a lawyer (my brother is a lawyer in London so I know what they go through) and yet we have to scrape away for money.

On average a private teacher would give 35 lessons a year, and with any luck would be teaching about 30 hours a week. By the time you prepare lessons, practise, swat up for your pupils, research repertoire and go out to buy their books you're easily into 40 hours a week.

So the sum 30 (pounds) times 30 hours times 35 weeks is 31500 per year. Thats a best case scenario. Ok a lawyer will start on £15000 for a traineeship, then it will jump to £26000 in the first year and rise in increments from there. Its not long before the lawyer has far outstripped the piano teacher. The lawyer also knows they're going to be paid! They don't have to cope with students dropping out, etc.

I know what you mean. I currently earn more than my wife who is a trainee lawyer but as soon as she qualifies it will be the other way around, but I wouldn't have it any other way. We have spent a similar length of time in terms of training and qualifications but I love doing my job and would hate to be working in an office!

As I see it, a private piano teacher can charge a similar amount to a personal trainer who visits people homes. We are personal trainers specialising in music rather than fitness. I recently took on a new student with a rather large house who also engaged the services of a personal trainer. After some discussion she was quite happy to pay me the same rate as her personal trainer for lessons which incidentally was slightly higher than what I would normally charge.

Whilst musical training and experience takes longer perhaps than the time it takes to train to be a personal fitness specialist I don't know any of my professional musician friends and colleagues who chose the avenue for the pecuniary gains!

williamhhay · Post by **williamhhay** » 30 Oct 2008, 12:19

Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:26 pm Post subject:
piano teachers have to earn a decent living. I studied for the same length of time as a doctor or a lawyer (my brother is a lawyer in London so I know what they go through) and yet we have to scrape away for money.

On average a private teacher would give 35 lessons a year, and with any luck would be teaching about 30 hours a week. By the time you prepare lessons, practise, swat up for your pupils, research repertoire and go out to buy their books you're easily into 40 hours a week.

So the sum 30 (pounds) times 30 hours times 35 weeks is 31500 per year. Thats a best case scenario. Ok a lawyer will start on £15000 for a traineeship, then it will jump to £26000 in the first year and rise in increments from there. Its not long before the lawyer has far outstripped the piano teacher. The lawyer also knows they're going to be paid! They don't have to cope with students dropping out, etc.

I know what you mean. I currently earn more than my wife who is a trainee lawyer but as soon as she qualifies it will be the other way around, but I wouldn't have it any other way. We have spent a similar length of time in terms of training and qualifications but I love doing my job and would hate to be working in an office!

As I see it, a private piano teacher can charge a similar amount to a personal trainer who visits people homes. We are personal trainers specialising in music rather than fitness. I recently took on a new student with a rather large house who also engaged the services of a personal trainer. After some discussion she was quite happy to pay me the same rate as her personal trainer for lessons which incidentally was slightly higher than what I would normally charge.

Whilst musical training and experience takes longer perhaps than the time it takes to train to be a personal fitness specialist I don't know any of my professional musician friends and colleagues who chose the avenue for the pecuniary gains!

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 30 Oct 2008, 17:43

i need a personal trainer - all that sitting on my backside teaching piano and playing piano has done my gut wonders.... it just keeps on growing

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 30 Oct 2008, 22:42

ok, well i'm not quite at that stage yet, but i'm about to pour myself a large single malt. . . .

Nutroast · Post by **Nutroast** » 31 Oct 2008, 08:30

dave brum wrote:my blended weasel's piss

Have you ever thought of going into advertising?

J
xxx

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 31 Oct 2008, 19:18

don't get their blended weasel's piss, they do a nice single malt range, about 13 quid a litre.

alexalin · Post by **alexalin** » 05 Nov 2008, 09:42

Hi,It's totally depends upon place.Where you are living.You are saying that you are get piano lessons for 6 pounds a lesson.See if you come to my place to learn the piano then you will get shocked by listing the price of one lesson.Can you guess it's 15 pounds and the duration is 3 weeks.

D Minor · Post by **D Minor** » 07 Nov 2008, 18:42

Well I've just been to my favourite farm shop to purchase the weekly meat and veg. Don't like supermarkets.

Someone is advertising piano lessons...45 mins for a tenner. I think 30 mins is £8.

I don't think it's a case of the 'little old lady down the road' rather the case of the 'girl'.

joseph · Post by **joseph** » 07 Nov 2008, 19:00

so obviously not doing it for a living. At my school, a 30 minute lesson costs £19. Obviously I get less than that for the lesson, but the school supply me with a steady stream (ok, more of a deluge) of pupils, a room, heating and lighting, and a really crap baby grand piano. All I have to do is turn up and teach what i am given.

I have taught many people who have started out with the cheap unqualified piano teachers, and I have spent so long correcting bad teaching and, to be fair, bad habits that the pupils get themselves into, I think that if I had a pound for every bad habit i've seen I'd be rich.

Never mind that extra long sentence above which I have split up with commas. . . .

I've also had to correct for pushy parents that want their kids moved 'up a grade'. Why? OH WHY DON'T THEY JUST LET US DO OUR JOB!

alexalin · Post by **alexalin** » 10 Nov 2008, 15:16

Hey!! Could any one help to provide the details of piano fees.I am very much interested to learn the piano and let me know the details of the musical school.

S.Mitchell · Post by **S.Mitchell** » 04 Jan 2009, 00:31

I paid 40 australian dollars for lessons with one woman (about £20), but she was also a qualified Alexander Technique teacher, so I got a lot of extra value from her showing me proper physical technique (considering normal Alexander Technique lessons are more expensive and not tailored specifically for piano). That was probably one of the best teachers I've ever had, I think it was definitely worth the money.

My teacher in high school cost £10 per hour, and that seemed very fair, but certainly not as good as the australian woman, despite being half the price.

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