Hi,
I am about to purchase a new silent Yamaha P121 SG.
I have been told that the set-off of the hammer on the silent yamaha is 8mm as opposed to the 3mm on a normal acoustic and that this will affect the touch in both silent and acoustic mode. As I am living in Ireland, I cannot get hold of a silent 121 and an acoustic to compare. My question therefore is -
If I really dislike the action on the silent will I be able to disable the silent system and readjust the set off to 3mm. Will I then have a perfectly normal acoustic piano action? There is a suggestion from earlier posts that an upright won't be exactly the same after the system is removed whereas a grand will. I need to be sure of the facts before I purchase.
I was also looking at a Seiler Eduard which I can get with a silent system. A 116cm Seiler Eduard will cost more than a Yamaha 121cm. Is it worth the extra seeing that the Yamaha is bigger (which is evidently important). Would size make up for the difference in quality. I have also been told that the Seiler Eduard is make in China and therefore not as good quality as a German Seiler.Is this true? I have emailed Seiler but they haven't answered.
Hope someone can help?
Disable silent system
Moderators: Feg, Gill the Piano, Melodytune
Re: Disable silent system
I would have thought so apart from the rail that catches the hammers which will need to be kept in the off position.Claire wrote:Hi,
If I really dislike the action on the silent will I be able to disable the silent system and readjust the set off to 3mm. Will I then have a perfectly normal acoustic piano action?
It will be a bit of an expensive mistake to make if you do go down that route as you are paying agout £1000 extra for the system.
I always sugest to customers that buy it once and buy it right. You are about to spent a big bucket of cash on a product you shouldnt ( if you get it right) ever need to replace. So take a bit of time and dont rush.
Re: Disable silent system
The build quality of a German Seiler upright lags behind that of a Yamaha, so steer clear of a Chinese one. Schimmels are cheaper and better built.Claire wrote: I have also been told that the Seiler Eduard is make in China and therefore not as good quality as a German Seiler.Is this true? I have emailed Seiler but they haven't answered.
Hope someone can help?
Seiler grands are nicely put together though.
I have been told the opposite - Seiler are quality and Yamaha are good but mass produced.
Seiler just sent email saying that the Eduard Seiler has a ' self made action with parts from China' and 'everything else is German made'. Not sure that I understand the implication of this.
Played a Seiler Eduard and a U1 today. I found the action on the Yamaha much heavier than the Seiler but the tone on the Yamaha was better. Dilemma.
I have also noticed that the sustain pedal on any Yamahas I have played has not been very effective. Is this just me?
Seiler just sent email saying that the Eduard Seiler has a ' self made action with parts from China' and 'everything else is German made'. Not sure that I understand the implication of this.
Played a Seiler Eduard and a U1 today. I found the action on the Yamaha much heavier than the Seiler but the tone on the Yamaha was better. Dilemma.
I have also noticed that the sustain pedal on any Yamahas I have played has not been very effective. Is this just me?
I have been told the opposite - Seiler are quality and Yamaha are good but mass produced.
Seiler just sent email saying that the Eduard Seiler has a ' self made action with parts from China' and 'everything else is German made'. Not sure that I understand the implication of this.
Played a Seiler Eduard and a U1 today. I found the action on the Yamaha much heavier than the Seiler but the tone on the Yamaha was better. Dilemma.
I have also noticed that the sustain pedal on any Yamahas I have played has not been very effective. Is this just me?
Seiler just sent email saying that the Eduard Seiler has a ' self made action with parts from China' and 'everything else is German made'. Not sure that I understand the implication of this.
Played a Seiler Eduard and a U1 today. I found the action on the Yamaha much heavier than the Seiler but the tone on the Yamaha was better. Dilemma.
I have also noticed that the sustain pedal on any Yamahas I have played has not been very effective. Is this just me?
Claire wrote:I have been told the opposite - Seiler are quality and Yamaha are good but mass produced.
Mass production does not exclude good build quality. Medium-cost hand-building can result in poor product consistency. I've never been impressed by any modern Seiler upright. Old ones were certainly well made. You are buying in to the myth of German build quality being unerringly excellent. This is not the case. Anybody who has dealt with Mercedes Benz recently could tell you that their once superb products are no longer so, and their customer service is also in decline. I would guess that the profit margin on a Seiler is greater than that on a Yamaha which may be why someone is steering you towards one.
Yamaha actions are superb when correctly regulated although the Renner fitted to a Seiler should give it a run for its money. The Chinese action in the Eduard theoretically would be the poor relation. Are you playing silent or standard versions of both, or one silent and the other a conventional version?
There is absolutely nothing wrong with Yamaha sustaining pedals, but if you're trying a piano in a dealership that hasn't bothered to adjust it correctly for playing it may be an idea to go elsewhere.
Hi Claire,
If you are in the Irish Republic and are looking at new Seilers, I can tell you the people retailing them new make virtually double the percentage on a Seiler than they do on a Yamaha.
This could be why they are pushing the Seiler?
It is for the same reason they push people towards Kawai rather than Yamaha......profit margins.
I would also recommend Schimmel ahead of Seiler.
As far as i'm aware, there is no Schimmel dealer in the south, only Hendersons who are in Derry, i think?
If you are in the Irish Republic and are looking at new Seilers, I can tell you the people retailing them new make virtually double the percentage on a Seiler than they do on a Yamaha.
This could be why they are pushing the Seiler?
It is for the same reason they push people towards Kawai rather than Yamaha......profit margins.
I would also recommend Schimmel ahead of Seiler.
As far as i'm aware, there is no Schimmel dealer in the south, only Hendersons who are in Derry, i think?
Thanks for your response -
To be fair to the dealer - he really only has Yamaha, Kawai or Seiler in new upright and he isn't pushy at all. I want a new silent - so my market is limited. Also I don't really want black - which makes it even more difficult. So I can get a discounted yamaha from the UK ( which would have to be black as the american walnut is pretty awful) or a much more expensive Seiler in Ireland. Therefore I want to be sure that the Seiler is worth paying extra for. So far from responses I have received it appears that a Seiler Eduard isn't great so now I have to consider an even more expensive Seiler.
I haven't even considered a Schimmel as there is no Schimmel dealer in Republic.
At this stage I am weary and need to get on with the rest of my life. I think I'll just stick with my 1950 Berry (which I love) but has only 73 notes. (There aren't notes missing it was made like that)
To be fair to the dealer - he really only has Yamaha, Kawai or Seiler in new upright and he isn't pushy at all. I want a new silent - so my market is limited. Also I don't really want black - which makes it even more difficult. So I can get a discounted yamaha from the UK ( which would have to be black as the american walnut is pretty awful) or a much more expensive Seiler in Ireland. Therefore I want to be sure that the Seiler is worth paying extra for. So far from responses I have received it appears that a Seiler Eduard isn't great so now I have to consider an even more expensive Seiler.
I haven't even considered a Schimmel as there is no Schimmel dealer in Republic.
At this stage I am weary and need to get on with the rest of my life. I think I'll just stick with my 1950 Berry (which I love) but has only 73 notes. (There aren't notes missing it was made like that)